Microsoft unveils Surface Book laptop & Surface Pro 4 tablet with new Surface Pen

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  • Reply 201 of 251
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    canukstorm wrote: »

    I find Nilay Patel in particular an unbearable jerk.
  • Reply 202 of 251
    formosaformosa Posts: 261member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CanukStorm View Post

     



    You might find this a little more unbearable;

     

    http://www.theverge.com/2015/10/7/9470861/microsoft-ceo-satya-nadella-interview-video-surface-book-windows-10




    Interesting interview. At 1:40, the interviewer tells (not asks) Nadella that you have hardware partners, but the Surface Book seems so much better (than the partners could achieve) because of the vertical development. It wasn't a direct question, but close. Nadella didn't directly reply to this statement.

     

    From the article:

    "Nadella is playing a long game, and he's insisting Microsoft start by focusing on what he calls the "leading indicators of success" like customer engagement and usage, instead of the "lagging indicators" like profits and revenue. It's an entirely new culture at the company..."

     

    The bolding is mine. It sure sounds to me like MS is copying Apple from the top down, and screw the OEM's if it means Apple-like success.

  • Reply 203 of 251
    canukstormcanukstorm Posts: 2,680member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by formosa View Post

     



    Interesting interview. At 1:40, the interviewer tells (not asks) Nadella that you have hardware partners, but the Surface Book seems so much better (than the partners could achieve) because of the vertical development. It wasn't a direct question, but close. Nadella didn't directly reply to this statement.

     

    From the article:

    "Nadella is playing a long game, and he's insisting Microsoft start by focusing on what he calls the "leading indicators of success" like customer engagement and usage, instead of the "lagging indicators" like profits and revenue. It's an entirely new culture at the company..."

     

    The bolding is mine. It sure sounds to me like MS is copying Apple from the top down, and screw the OEM's if it means Apple-like success.


     

    " It sure sounds to me like MS is copying Apple from the top down, and screw the OEM's if it means Apple-like success."

     

    That's exactly what they're doing.  Anything else is rhetoric to try and not piss off their OEMs.  

  • Reply 204 of 251
    Looks like another of Microsoft's line of unsellable creations - Zune, Windows Phone, Surface and now the Surface Book!

    Nobody is going to pay the same amount of money for a Windows laptop as a MacBook Pro Retina. It maybe years ahead but after it fails, Apple will just take the Surface Book design and put an Apple Logo on the back and release it as another wonderful invention by Apple and it will sell like crazy!
  • Reply 205 of 251
    chadbagchadbag Posts: 1,994member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by auxio View Post

     



    I wouldn't exactly call this elegant...

     


     

    Why not? It is certainly different from Apple, but it is very elegant.  Too bad it runs Windows.  But at least MS is pulling its head out of its proverbial arse and doing some thinking different of its own.   That will keep the competition up and not let anyone, including Apple, get to complacent.

  • Reply 206 of 251
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    canukstorm wrote: »

    Interesting. You wouldn't get that from following the blogosphere. I've seen some comments saying it was a better presentation than the 2007 iPhone keynote. Crazy, I know.

    I loved the tweet from Fake Jony Ive account that if you think Apple is a cult you should read some of the tweets on the Surface Book. :lol:
  • Reply 207 of 251

    There is not a single ARM out there that matches Core i  in processing power.  A9X is just another ARM and getting Core M level processing power would be hitting jack pot, if that were the case A9X would have been in Mac Book Air.

  • Reply 208 of 251
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    canukstorm wrote: »
    " It sure sounds to me like MS is copying Apple from the top down, and screw the OEM's if it means Apple-like success."

    That's exactly what they're doing.  Anything else is rhetoric to try and not piss off their OEMs.  

    What's really annoying is Microsoft only compares their stuff to Apple (understandably) so then that's basically all the tech media compares it to too. I get why Microsoft can't directly compare to their OEM partners, but doesn't mean the tech media can't. It's really stupid because these Microsoft hardware products are more likely competing with other Windows hardware products than they are with Apple products.
  • Reply 209 of 251
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    There is not a single ARM out there that matches Core i  in processing power.  A9X is just another ARM and getting Core M level processing power would be hitting jack pot, if that were the case A9X would have been in Mac Book Air.

    And what software would have run on this theoretical device?
  • Reply 210 of 251
    majanimajani Posts: 92member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

     

     

     

    Uh, "one of the fastest"? Sorry, it's THE fastest ARM processor out there. By a landslide.


     

    No, the ARMv8.1-A beats the ARMv8-A found in the A9X. It entered fabrication earlier this year, but guessing it just missed the mark for the iPad Pro.

     

     

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Relic View Post





    Which begs the question, will we ever see an ARM based Macbook. I would be all over that, we'll if it also had a touchscreen or at the very least support Apple's new stylus as I will no longer be buying another laptop without such features.

     

    I'd be fairly willing to bet no. It would require re-writing OSX for the ARM architecture, and absolutely no existing OSX applications would function on it - see the Windows RT problem, i.e. Windows on the ARM architecture.

     

    What i'd more imaging would happen would be introducing pointer features into iOS properly, implementing more desktop-oriented options for having it docked and going further with the iPad Pro with a keyboard / Microsoft Surface route. I don't see them releasing OSX for ARM. Maybe iOSX?

  • Reply 211 of 251
    auxioauxio Posts: 2,707member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chadbag View Post

     

    Why not? It is certainly different from Apple, but it is very elegant.


     

    That hinge is about as elegant as a drainage hose with those lumps.  And then there's the 'gap'... which, even if you don't have an eye for clean lines, you have to respect that from a structural engineering perspective, is a breakage point waiting (weighting) to happen.

  • Reply 212 of 251
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    auxio wrote: »
    That hinge is about as elegant as a drainage hose with those lumps.  And then there's the 'gap'... which, even if you don't have an eye for clean lines, you have to respect that from a structural engineering perspective, is a breakage point waiting (weighting) to happen.

    It comes with the same technology as the shoulders of a 1970's robot.


    [VIDEO]
  • Reply 213 of 251

    Just don't.  ?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by VonBrick View Post

     

    Somehow, we are all so blinded with anti-competitor hatred here that we're missing the point, apparently. 

     

    Because it doesn't seem that anyone has brought this up yet, here:  There are now high quality devices from Microsoft in pretty much every price range...all offering a consistent fit, form and function.  All running the same (pretty much) operating system.  This is pretty much exactly what Apple has done with the MacBook products.  The only difference is that MS has a consistent OS experience among them all.

     

    Mark my words, gang...if Microsoft convinces the world that running an app consistently on your phone, your tablet, your computer, your gaming system, etc. is something they want, then Microsoft hit it out of the park on Tuesday.  I'm not so sure they didn't do that already.

     

    And, oh, yes...I'm confident that by saying these things makes me a "Microsoft shill", an "Apple hater", a "Love It All Lively", blah blah blah.  Listen...there is nothing wrong with rewarding excellence.  And Microsoft had an excellent presentation and should be held up as FINALLY realizing how to compete again.


     

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

     

    10 posts here in 6 years.........

     

    that explains it all.?


     

    Hey, sog35...just don't.  I have Apple receipts totaling $19,600 in the last five years.  My family of four carries iPhone 5s and 6 Plus's and that doesn't include thousands in iTunes purchases over the last 7 years.



    10 posts in 6 years means I don't feel the need to spout off daily in a message board to feel more important than I did before somebody said something that I didn't agree with or somehow doesn't jibe with my extremely small and personally specific technical world view.



    I actually enjoy Apple Insider very much.

     

    Have a better than average day, "sog".

  • Reply 214 of 251
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 2,074member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post





    I have been using Surface Pro 3 with stylus and it is really fluid; I don't think that SB will have any issues here in tablet mode. Integrated GPUs have involved enough to cover pretty much all 2D needs fine, but if additional GPU in keyboard can provide some semi-decent 3D - and it just might, once DX12 starts sneaking into games - then this device can be real multitasker - useful tablet, laptop, light gaming machine. Looks quite attractive to me.

     

    I just got a Surface 3 and really do like the kick stand and how the keyboard cover magnetically attaches at an angle.    

    The cover/keyboard for the iPad Pro seems limited in comparison (only two angles vs 3).    I think that the Surface Pro 4 will be a big hit

    for MS with its increased power and new cover-keyboard.   I expect sales of the SP 4 to be up at least 50% next year.

    Oh and the new pen sounds sweet too.   I really like that the SP 4 gives you a very light laptop for traveling.

     

    I thought it was nice how the pen attached to the Surface Book but it would have been cooler if the pen would have gotten automatically recharged when attached to the surface book.   I don't know if the Surface Book will take off.    My only negative point about the two products is lack of LTE/SIM.    They look like great laptops but aren't mobile computing platforms the way the iPad is.

  • Reply 215 of 251
    chadbagchadbag Posts: 1,994member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by auxio View Post

     

     

    That hinge is about as elegant as a drainage hose with those lumps.  And then there's the 'gap'... which, even if you don't have an eye for clean lines, you have to respect that from a structural engineering perspective, is a breakage point waiting (weighting) to happen.




    I suspect that their engineers know a few things.  And I think the things is quite interesting from a design perspective.  Time will tell how they hold up.

     

    I personally prefer the Mac aesthetic myself, but these new MS devices certainly don't look like your every day bottom of the barrel design like most PCs

  • Reply 216 of 251
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chadbag View Post

     

    I personally prefer the Mac aesthetic myself, but these new MS devices certainly don't look like your every day bottom of the barrel design like most PCs


     

    Personally I find most off-the-shelf computers to be the bottom of the barrel PC/Windows experience, building your own is where it's at.

     

    On the laptop front though, it's the trackpad that sells me on Macbooks. I don't care if it is $500 over the odds for a windows laptop it's still worth it.

  • Reply 217 of 251
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,242member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by MAJANI View Post

     

     

    No, the ARMv8.1-A beats the ARMv8-A found in the A9X. It entered fabrication earlier this year, but guessing it just missed the mark for the iPad Pro.


    A little reading would indicate that ARM 8.1-A architecture doesn't bring all that much performance benefit; it mostly allows a system that's more robust for applications beyond mobile. As well, you don't know if it is or isn't implemented in the A9X.

     

    As of today, the A9X is the highest performance ARM processor for mobile in production, and it hasn't been benchmarked AFAIK. If you don't agree with my statement, nor agree with EricTheHalfBee's statements, then link a source saying otherwise.

     

    For the record, nVidia X1 is barely on the level of the A8X; it will be crushed by the A9X.

  • Reply 218 of 251
    robertcrobertc Posts: 118member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post





    I see you conveniently ignored the rest of my post. I wonder why?

    I was stating that Geekbench is not a reliable source for comparing x86 to ARM. 

     

    The rest of your post was irrelevant.

  • Reply 219 of 251

    I can't believe it, the laptop commercial shows the nVidia graphics chip in the keyboard half, then it detaches the screen, separating the graphics chip from the screen! You can only get full graphic capabilities when the two halves are together, thereby loosing the thin and lightness of the screen clipboard in tablet mode. Has Microsoft gone crazy? Wouldn't you want both the CPU and GPU together inside the screen half?

  • Reply 220 of 251
    robertcrobertc Posts: 118member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tmay View Post

     

    For the record, nVidia X1 is barely on the level of the A8X; it will be crushed by the A9X.


    For CPU, yes. The next Denver based Tegra SoC is said to be coming out late this year (unless nVidia pushes it to their Pascel based Tegra in 2016). 

     

    For GPU? No, nVidia's Maxwell GPU is far ahead.

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