I'm impressed. Apple is losing its edge to these competitors. Light, thin, elegant.... no longer Apple-defining characteristics.
I begrudgingly have to agree with you here, these are good products that give Apple a run for their money in the design stakes. And full power Windows 10, i7 CPU's and up to a 1TB hard drive in something about the same size as an iPad Pro is quite impressive. It seems to me MS are getting their act together lately and becoming real competition for Apple with their own unique design language. Competition is beneficial to everybody, and I hope with the next round Apple picks up the gauntlet!
What are those dingleberries protruding from the kb component after the display component is removed?
[image]
On the very edge, it's the curve of the keyboard so the rounded rectangle of the Surface can fit in there and look natural.
The ones just inside of that MS calls Muscle Wire Locks which is how it gets secured in place (curious to see how that actually works for placing and removing. Their video shows the internal mechanics briefly but I couldn't get a good for its operation.
The three in the center I'd guess include the pins for power and data. Remember the larger of the battery packs, the dGPU, DisplayPort port, USB 3.0 ports, and SD card slot is the main housing so being Bluetooth isn't going to cut it.
They don't look very breakable to me. The width, length and height of the components appear to me to avoid that as a major concern. I'm more concerned with how easily it is to attach and detach the tablet section, and how well the pins line up for getting a good data throughput. For example, it offers USB 3.0, but what if that data connection in the center tab of the keyboard section doesn't connect well enough to the slot in the tablet section , could the speeds be highly reduced? I'm sure we'll see some benchmarks.
I don't see how Apple is losing their edge. In fact, I'd argue that Apple's lead is increasing each year due to their veridical and lateral integration, that no one else is even coming close to replicating. How long before we see anything that comes close to 3D Touch on another device due the use of at least 3 different HW components, and an OS with frameworks and APIs that need to be developed to make it a useful and convenient feature.
Are those air vents on the top edge?
Not only that, but no one has come even remotely close to matching how good Apple's trackpad is on their laptops.
What are those dingleberries protruding from the kb component after the display component is removed?
[image]
On the very edge, it's the curve of the keyboard so the rounded rectangle of the Surface can fit in there and look natural.
The ones just inside of that MS calls Muscle Wire Locks which is how it gets secured in place (curious to see how that actually works for placing and removing. Their video shows the internal mechanics briefly but I couldn't get a good for its operation.
The three in the center I'd guess include the pins for power and data. Remember the larger of the battery packs, the dGPU, DisplayPort port, USB 3.0 ports, and SD card slot is the main housing so being Bluetooth isn't going to cut it.
Mmm ...
Maybe MS has a feature where you can drop the display into place from a height of 2-3 feet ...
Honestly, I had better results with hand tools in Beginning Woodshop in the 1950s!
For dingleberry comparison ... (Should that be a new Spec?)
So basically a SurfaceBook that's comperable to iPad Air 2/iPad Pro in terms of weight only gets 3 hours battery life? lol
All of this seems very confused. If the Surface Pro is the ultimate no compromises device why does Microsoft need the SurfaceBook? And why is one called "Pro" and the other "Book"? I think it would make more sense if Microsoft just admitted there are compromises and the two devices exist so people can choose which trade off they're willing to accept.
That's not a fair comparison. The iPad Pro's keyboard doesn't to transport the same amount from the keyboard to the tablet section. Remember, it has all those ports and the Nvidia discreet GPU. That means you need a lot more pins to move the data, at least until optical is an option, which is a patent we saw recently.
Who cares if it looks cool (IMO, it looks ugly as hell, sorta like having a car that has a door that does not completely shut by design). Just buy a touch screen laptop instead.
Having the screen detach is a gimmick since it only has a 3 hour battery life when its not connected to the dock.
Funny how the video never shows the device completely shut for longer than a split second in its profile view. Obvious that even Microsoft knows it looks ugly as sin when 'shut'. Something like this would never make it into production at Apple.
So I wonder if all the tech geeks that constantly complain about bezels are going to knock this device for its bezels. Yeah that's a rhetorical question. Just like the hinge would be fugly if anyone but Microsoft (or maybe Google) announced it.
Btw, in case anyone is interested, check out the tweets from a Disney employee who got hands on time with the iPad Pro. This is what he had to say about the Pencil:
[QUOTE]Christopher Mahan ?@chris_mahan @paulhildebrandt (I don't care about OCR, I care about handwriting fidelity, and speed, and precision (can it emulate 0.1 Micron pen?)
Paul Hildebrandt @paulhildebrandt @chris_mahan it was amazing. The pencil and the iPad Pro are serious want now. [/QUOTE]
Gah! I'm really tired of the abuse that I've been getting here. I share my *opinions* and 20 people need to tell me that I'm wrong?!? Can't you just focus on your own opinions without making personal attacks against other posters? :mad:
You don't like 20 people sharing their *opinions*?
That's not a fair comparison. The iPad Pro's keyboard doesn't to transport the same amount from the keyboard to the tablet section. Remember, it has all those ports and the Nvidia discreet GPU. That means you need a lot more pins to move the data, at least until optical is an option, which is a patent we saw recently.
Point taken!
Edit:
However, it is interesting that Apple did not need to separate battery and GPU electronics among 2 separate device components.
I begrudgingly have to agree with you here, these are good products that give Apple a run for their money in the design stakes. And full power Windows 10, i7 CPU's and up to a 1TB hard drive in something about the same size as an iPad Pro is quite impressive. It seems to me MS are getting their act together lately and becoming real competition for Apple with their own unique design language. Competition is beneficial to everybody, and I hope with the next round Apple picks up the gauntlet!
Windows 10, and I've run all sorts, on many devices is a craphole barely better than Windows 7. Not sure how they're "catching up"
The hardware is actually kinda nice. The biggest problem is Windows and "Metro" or whatever it is they call it these days. The thing is maddening. One of the biggest benefits of these tablets is supposed to be backwards compatibility with existing Windows software, yeah, good luck using Word or Visual Studio on that small screen with 267dpi.
You do realize that Word and Visual Studio are HiDPI aware right? Second, the screen is not running natively at the full resolution. It's going to be using a scaling factor that's comfortable enough even on the Surface Pro 3. I am using Windows 10 on a 4K display, and Word is beautiful. Now, there're software that are not HiDPI aware, but most of MS stuffs are good. You should have used another software as an example instead.
Yeah, I was baffled by this too. If it was just trying to be a laptop, then I'd say it has pretty decent specs for the price. But then they throw in a stylus and make the screen detachable (at the expense of graphics performance, which is exactly what's needed for a fluid stylus experience in drawing apps). That's where they lost me with it.
The screen is reversible so you could flip the screen over while having the keyboard underneath. The good thing is that it also provides an angle for better writing and drawing. Note that the keyboard buttons are NOT underneath unlike the Yoga style.
Comments
I'm impressed. Apple is losing its edge to these competitors. Light, thin, elegant.... no longer Apple-defining characteristics.
I begrudgingly have to agree with you here, these are good products that give Apple a run for their money in the design stakes. And full power Windows 10, i7 CPU's and up to a 1TB hard drive in something about the same size as an iPad Pro is quite impressive. It seems to me MS are getting their act together lately and becoming real competition for Apple with their own unique design language. Competition is beneficial to everybody, and I hope with the next round Apple picks up the gauntlet!
They don't look very breakable to me. The width, length and height of the components appear to me to avoid that as a major concern. I'm more concerned with how easily it is to attach and detach the tablet section, and how well the pins line up for getting a good data throughput. For example, it offers USB 3.0, but what if that data connection in the center tab of the keyboard section doesn't connect well enough to the slot in the tablet section , could the speeds be highly reduced? I'm sure we'll see some benchmarks.
I don't see how Apple is losing their edge. In fact, I'd argue that Apple's lead is increasing each year due to their veridical and lateral integration, that no one else is even coming close to replicating. How long before we see anything that comes close to 3D Touch on another device due the use of at least 3 different HW components, and an OS with frameworks and APIs that need to be developed to make it a useful and convenient feature.
Are those air vents on the top edge?
Not only that, but no one has come even remotely close to matching how good Apple's trackpad is on their laptops.
Mmm ...
Maybe MS has a feature where you can drop the display into place from a height of 2-3 feet ...
Honestly, I had better results with hand tools in Beginning Woodshop in the 1950s!
For dingleberry comparison ... (Should that be a new Spec?)
iPad Pro:
SB:
All of this seems very confused. If the Surface Pro is the ultimate no compromises device why does Microsoft need the SurfaceBook? And why is one called "Pro" and the other "Book"? I think it would make more sense if Microsoft just admitted there are compromises and the two devices exist so people can choose which trade off they're willing to accept.
That's not a fair comparison. The iPad Pro's keyboard doesn't to transport the same amount from the keyboard to the tablet section. Remember, it has all those ports and the Nvidia discreet GPU. That means you need a lot more pins to move the data, at least until optical is an option, which is a patent we saw recently.
So I wonder if all the tech geeks that constantly complain about bezels are going to knock this device for its bezels. Yeah that's a rhetorical question. Just like the hinge would be fugly if anyone but Microsoft (or maybe Google) announced it.
[QUOTE]Christopher Mahan ?@chris_mahan
@paulhildebrandt (I don't care about OCR, I care about handwriting fidelity, and speed, and precision (can it emulate 0.1 Micron pen?)
Paul Hildebrandt @paulhildebrandt
@chris_mahan it was amazing. The pencil and the iPad Pro are serious want now.
[/QUOTE]
https://twitter.com/paulhildebrandt
You don't like 20 people sharing their *opinions*?
When the first MBA was announced by Steve Jobs, he took it out, closed, from an envelope.
If you really want to argue, yes, it's not a video but a live presentation.
But you can always go watch the event or the MBA envelope ads on YouTube again.
And just like that ad, in the video already posted, the first image is of the Surface Book closed.
If you* don't like it, fine, but making up reasons to dislike it is ridiculous.
* By you, I of course, mean the great maker-upper of stuff, sog35
We've had MS' take on the tablet (Surface Pro), they're take on the laptop (Surface Book), what's next? A Surface Desktop?
http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2015/10/with-microsoft-launching-their-first-notebook-today-could-a-desktop-be-next.html
If this was an Apple product, the forums would be full of people complaining about "obsession with thinness and weight."
But it's a Microsoft product so it is automatically declared "impressive" and a sign that Apple is "losing its edge."
Edit:
However, it is interesting that Apple did not need to separate battery and GPU electronics among 2 separate device components.
I begrudgingly have to agree with you here, these are good products that give Apple a run for their money in the design stakes. And full power Windows 10, i7 CPU's and up to a 1TB hard drive in something about the same size as an iPad Pro is quite impressive. It seems to me MS are getting their act together lately and becoming real competition for Apple with their own unique design language. Competition is beneficial to everybody, and I hope with the next round Apple picks up the gauntlet!
Windows 10, and I've run all sorts, on many devices is a craphole barely better than Windows 7. Not sure how they're "catching up"
The hardware is actually kinda nice. The biggest problem is Windows and "Metro" or whatever it is they call it these days. The thing is maddening. One of the biggest benefits of these tablets is supposed to be backwards compatibility with existing Windows software, yeah, good luck using Word or Visual Studio on that small screen with 267dpi.
You do realize that Word and Visual Studio are HiDPI aware right? Second, the screen is not running natively at the full resolution. It's going to be using a scaling factor that's comfortable enough even on the Surface Pro 3. I am using Windows 10 on a 4K display, and Word is beautiful. Now, there're software that are not HiDPI aware, but most of MS stuffs are good. You should have used another software as an example instead.
Yeah, I was baffled by this too. If it was just trying to be a laptop, then I'd say it has pretty decent specs for the price. But then they throw in a stylus and make the screen detachable (at the expense of graphics performance, which is exactly what's needed for a fluid stylus experience in drawing apps). That's where they lost me with it.
The screen is reversible so you could flip the screen over while having the keyboard underneath. The good thing is that it also provides an angle for better writing and drawing. Note that the keyboard buttons are NOT underneath unlike the Yoga style.