FWIW, I've mentioned here that I'm beta testing a third party app to run on Tiger, and the developer didn't bother to send me the previously released build of Tiger because it was so problemmatic. Well, this new build is apparently a quantum leap in terms of its quality, and I will be receiving it. So while this good news isn't indicative of an imminent release date, it's not as incongruous to put the April release rumor out there with this current build as it was when the really buggy one was the latest and greatest. BTW, developers are in the dark about a release date as much as Joe Fanboi.
Absolutely. The state of a product between builds should only really be guaged as a general trend across 5 or 6 builds, not just any two sequential builds.
I'm sure any developer would recognise this pattern. Sometimes you change something that makes something else misbehave, and then it snowballs from there. The general state of the code and product hasn't just made a leap backwards -- you're just seeing a lot of failures due to one oversight that happens to be in a core area.
Likewise, a whole lot of issues can suddenly disappear due to a fix in some code that lots of things utilise. A build where 'nothing works' is quite common, and not to be taken as a sign that there's a helluva lot of work to do.
For a taster, try playing with the Mozilla Organisation's nightly builds of their projects (Firefox, Camino, Seamonkey, etc). It's like software Russian Roulette at times
Well, I'll put it on one of my "safe" machines to try it out, if indeed it is coming out in April. I would do that even if it came out in June.
For those of us without "safe machines" I say wait till 7 days after it has been in the wild, by then, any major bugs or problems will be known, and if at that point it seems fine for my needs, I plan to go for it.
Can you customise the toolbars in all applications? Have just icons or icons/text or change the size of the icons?
You can customize all standard toolbars to show large orsmall icons, icons with or without text or text alone. You can also customize the layout of the items in the toolbar. If you don't see a "customize" icon in the toolbar itself, look in either the Window or View menus for an item, "customize toolbar...", or hold down the command and option keys and click on the elongated glossy button at the top right of the window's title bar. Any of these methods will drop a sheet that contains a selection of tools you can arrange in the toolbar as you wish, and at the bottom are the options for how to display these tools (icons only, icons with text, text only, small icons checkbox).
If you don't see the elongated button in the window, it isn't a standard toolbar and doesn't have the same options available to it. You might check in that application's view menu or in the app's preferences to see if there are any options for the toolbar there, however.
Tiger is VERY polished. Startup, copying, browsing, everything is sooooo smooth.
Good to hear that it is very polished.
Disappointed that Mail icons do not have a small option. Hopefully this will get included in the final (but I kind of doubt it). I would use "text only" in mail, except then you can't have a search field. With text only would allow for that.
Oh, are we talking about the new Mail icons? I just meant in general, like in Panther. Tiger Mail's toolbar is an oddball case.
The new release is very good in most repects. Still has some gotchas, but they're mostly minor from the ones I've encountered. What I've taken notice of the most are the subtle improvements to a lot of areas.
Yup. That one's been around for a while. There are others.
But it's not a problem because as we've been told here before by a "beta tester" that he tests e v e r y t h i n g, and that "Apple tests everything" also.
so it's just our imagination. Don't worry. Be happy.
Heh. Apple could always do what the FreeBSD guys do, and put a feature-frozen build of the OS out in the wild for five years of testing and bug fixing before calling it stable.
We'd all be able to look forward to OS X 10.0 stable this time next year! Yay! \
Heh. Apple could always do what the FreeBSD guys do, and put a feature-frozen build of the OS out in the wild for five years of testing and bug fixing before calling it stable.
We'd all be able to look forward to OS X 10.0 stable this time next year! Yay! \
That's actually not as funny as you think it is.
When mainframe OS's and the OS's for personal computers, as well as the hardware is compared, the reasons given for the incredible stability and reliabiliy of the former as compared to the latter is that very fact of continous upgrades, low prices, and poor testing on the pc side.
Really now, do we NEED a new OS every 12 to 18 months or so? Do we really NEED a new computer every 12 months or so? Or is it that we merely WANT a new one?
How many people get a new machine sooner than every 2, 3, or even 4 or more years? Business would be just as happy if they never had to upgrade. As long as their competitors couldn't either.
The manufactures have to stay in business, so they constantly upgrade. Growth, growth, growth.
But would it be so bad for the user if we could keep our machines and OS's for five years, and then upgrade to something MUCH better. Something that had been tested and reworked so that it was actually what it was supposed to be?
Can Mail's mailboxes side pane be moved to the right side?
Move the mail window to the left side of the screen. Click on the mailboxes icon to bring the side pane in, then click it again and it should show up on the right side.
I don't think it's THAT bad. I would prefer a more "industrial" them myself, but it could be much worse. It's a hell of alot cleaner looking to.
My concern was really with that specific toolbar customisation sheet. You'll notice that there are a number of duplicate entries, it's visually jumbled, there doesn't appear to be any organisation applied, and some of the labels aren't sufficiently verbal -- what does "Address" do? What does "Threads" do? People will learn the functions by exploration, but as long as Apple is bothering to label the buttons, there's no sense in being coy.
When it's considered on its own, I don't mind the theme so much. Some of the buttons look too small for their icons. It looks like the button height was chosen based on the 'arrow' icons -- Reply, Forward, Redirect, etc., without enough consideration for the more pictorial icons like Get Mail. The graphite colour weighs things down. It's acceptable, but not really worth it, in my opinion. The fact that there's a third theme, again diminishing the identity of the system for no apparent reason other than a disarrayed concept of aesthetics, is also bothersome. That's a more superficial point of view though; the real problem is the unwieldiness of the duplicate items, poor labels and lack of organisation that comprise the bulk of the design (of that sheet).
When mainframe OS's and the OS's for personal computers, as well as the hardware is compared, the reasons given for the incredible stability and reliabiliy of the former as compared to the latter is that very fact of continous upgrades, low prices, and poor testing on the pc side.
Really now, do we NEED a new OS every 12 to 18 months or so? Do we really NEED a new computer every 12 months or so? Or is it that we merely WANT a new one?
How many people get a new machine sooner than every 2, 3, or even 4 or more years? Business would be just as happy if they never had to upgrade. As long as their competitors couldn't either.
The manufactures have to stay in business, so they constantly upgrade. Growth, growth, growth.
But would it be so bad for the user if we could keep our machines and OS's for five years, and then upgrade to something MUCH better. Something that had been tested and reworked so that it was actually what it was supposed to be?
Not as much fun, no doubt, but certainly better.
You wouldn't be 65 years old and the CEO of a Fortune 500 company would you?
My concern was really with that specific toolbar customisation sheet. You'll notice that there are a number of duplicate entries, it's visually jumbled, there doesn't appear to be any organisation applied, and some of the labels aren't sufficiently verbal -- what does "Address" do? What does "Threads" do? People will learn the functions by exploration, but as long as Apple is bothering to label the buttons, there's no sense in being coy.
When it's considered on its own, I don't mind the theme so much. Some of the buttons look too small for their icons. It looks like the button height was chosen based on the 'arrow' icons -- Reply, Forward, Redirect, etc., without enough consideration for the more pictorial icons like Get Mail. The graphite colour weighs things down. It's acceptable, but not really worth it, in my opinion. The fact that there's a third theme, again diminishing the identity of the system for no apparent reason other than a disarrayed concept of aesthetics, is also bothersome. That's a more superficial point of view though; the real problem is the unwieldiness of the duplicate items, poor labels and lack of organisation that comprise the bulk of the design (of that sheet).
I'm betting that when 10.5 rolls around and Apple tweaks the GUI even more, that these new buttons and widgets in Tiger will be defended.
Most of these changes grow on us all. Some don't. I continue to look at the other side of the fence when pondering over these things. The grass still don't look greener over there, if ya know what I mean.
What I've taken notice of the most are the subtle improvements to a lot of areas.
I would like to know more of course, but these are always the things that make it fun to upgrade. You might be working with the new OS for a few weeks or even months and suddenly you notice a small change, something that just feels nice.
I work with XP everyday. I still keep finding things that irritate me. Tiger will enhance the pain of these discoveries during the day as well as to the joy of the evening when I sit back in front of the new OS X.
Don't you think they're getting a little paranoid? I don't see Microsoft running around and removing articles that talk about a pre-release version of LongHorn.
I haven't seen such a closed-to-public company in a long time. Next think you'll know, they'll label stuff as "state secret" and persecute anyone that says/writes/thinks the name "Tiger".
Nothing personal melgross. I just get enthusiastic when I see posts that infer that things should slow down.
Big business is exactly what is killing MS at this moment. While Apple and Linux and the others can be fleet of foot or try to push the envelope, big business keeps a boot in MS's a$$. And anyone who works in a PC environment suffers for it.
I can see your point and those like it, but I would rather see where things can go, not linger in what we have.
Comments
Originally posted by BuonRotto
FWIW, I've mentioned here that I'm beta testing a third party app to run on Tiger, and the developer didn't bother to send me the previously released build of Tiger because it was so problemmatic. Well, this new build is apparently a quantum leap in terms of its quality, and I will be receiving it. So while this good news isn't indicative of an imminent release date, it's not as incongruous to put the April release rumor out there with this current build as it was when the really buggy one was the latest and greatest. BTW, developers are in the dark about a release date as much as Joe Fanboi.
Absolutely. The state of a product between builds should only really be guaged as a general trend across 5 or 6 builds, not just any two sequential builds.
I'm sure any developer would recognise this pattern. Sometimes you change something that makes something else misbehave, and then it snowballs from there. The general state of the code and product hasn't just made a leap backwards -- you're just seeing a lot of failures due to one oversight that happens to be in a core area.
Likewise, a whole lot of issues can suddenly disappear due to a fix in some code that lots of things utilise. A build where 'nothing works' is quite common, and not to be taken as a sign that there's a helluva lot of work to do.
For a taster, try playing with the Mozilla Organisation's nightly builds of their projects (Firefox, Camino, Seamonkey, etc). It's like software Russian Roulette at times
Originally posted by admactanium
good question. i use text only for my toolbars.
Hi,
Can you customise the toolbars in all applications? Have just icons or icons/text or change the size of the icons?
Originally posted by melgross
Well, I'll put it on one of my "safe" machines to try it out, if indeed it is coming out in April. I would do that even if it came out in June.
For those of us without "safe machines" I say wait till 7 days after it has been in the wild, by then, any major bugs or problems will be known, and if at that point it seems fine for my needs, I plan to go for it.
Originally posted by xflare
Hi,
Can you customise the toolbars in all applications? Have just icons or icons/text or change the size of the icons?
You can customize all standard toolbars to show large orsmall icons, icons with or without text or text alone. You can also customize the layout of the items in the toolbar. If you don't see a "customize" icon in the toolbar itself, look in either the Window or View menus for an item, "customize toolbar...", or hold down the command and option keys and click on the elongated glossy button at the top right of the window's title bar. Any of these methods will drop a sheet that contains a selection of tools you can arrange in the toolbar as you wish, and at the bottom are the options for how to display these tools (icons only, icons with text, text only, small icons checkbox).
If you don't see the elongated button in the window, it isn't a standard toolbar and doesn't have the same options available to it. You might check in that application's view menu or in the app's preferences to see if there are any options for the toolbar there, however.
Tiger is VERY polished. Startup, copying, browsing, everything is sooooo smooth.
Originally posted by coldman1
Mail toolbar icons DO NOT have a small option.
Tiger is VERY polished. Startup, copying, browsing, everything is sooooo smooth.
Good to hear that it is very polished.
Disappointed that Mail icons do not have a small option. Hopefully this will get included in the final (but I kind of doubt it). I would use "text only" in mail, except then you can't have a search field. With text only would allow for that.
The new release is very good in most repects. Still has some gotchas, but they're mostly minor from the ones I've encountered. What I've taken notice of the most are the subtle improvements to a lot of areas.
Originally posted by melgross
Yup. That one's been around for a while. There are others.
But it's not a problem because as we've been told here before by a "beta tester" that he tests e v e r y t h i n g, and that "Apple tests everything" also.
so it's just our imagination. Don't worry. Be happy.
Heh. Apple could always do what the FreeBSD guys do, and put a feature-frozen build of the OS out in the wild for five years of testing and bug fixing before calling it stable.
We'd all be able to look forward to OS X 10.0 stable this time next year! Yay!
Originally posted by Amorph
Heh. Apple could always do what the FreeBSD guys do, and put a feature-frozen build of the OS out in the wild for five years of testing and bug fixing before calling it stable.
We'd all be able to look forward to OS X 10.0 stable this time next year! Yay!
That's actually not as funny as you think it is.
When mainframe OS's and the OS's for personal computers, as well as the hardware is compared, the reasons given for the incredible stability and reliabiliy of the former as compared to the latter is that very fact of continous upgrades, low prices, and poor testing on the pc side.
Really now, do we NEED a new OS every 12 to 18 months or so? Do we really NEED a new computer every 12 months or so? Or is it that we merely WANT a new one?
How many people get a new machine sooner than every 2, 3, or even 4 or more years? Business would be just as happy if they never had to upgrade. As long as their competitors couldn't either.
The manufactures have to stay in business, so they constantly upgrade. Growth, growth, growth.
But would it be so bad for the user if we could keep our machines and OS's for five years, and then upgrade to something MUCH better. Something that had been tested and reworked so that it was actually what it was supposed to be?
Not as much fun, no doubt, but certainly better.
Originally posted by bluesloth
Can Mail's mailboxes side pane be moved to the right side?
Move the mail window to the left side of the screen. Click on the mailboxes icon to bring the side pane in, then click it again and it should show up on the right side.
I don't think it's THAT bad. I would prefer a more "industrial" them myself, but it could be much worse. It's a hell of alot cleaner looking to.
My concern was really with that specific toolbar customisation sheet. You'll notice that there are a number of duplicate entries, it's visually jumbled, there doesn't appear to be any organisation applied, and some of the labels aren't sufficiently verbal -- what does "Address" do? What does "Threads" do? People will learn the functions by exploration, but as long as Apple is bothering to label the buttons, there's no sense in being coy.
When it's considered on its own, I don't mind the theme so much. Some of the buttons look too small for their icons. It looks like the button height was chosen based on the 'arrow' icons -- Reply, Forward, Redirect, etc., without enough consideration for the more pictorial icons like Get Mail. The graphite colour weighs things down. It's acceptable, but not really worth it, in my opinion. The fact that there's a third theme, again diminishing the identity of the system for no apparent reason other than a disarrayed concept of aesthetics, is also bothersome. That's a more superficial point of view though; the real problem is the unwieldiness of the duplicate items, poor labels and lack of organisation that comprise the bulk of the design (of that sheet).
Originally posted by melgross
That's actually not as funny as you think it is.
When mainframe OS's and the OS's for personal computers, as well as the hardware is compared, the reasons given for the incredible stability and reliabiliy of the former as compared to the latter is that very fact of continous upgrades, low prices, and poor testing on the pc side.
Really now, do we NEED a new OS every 12 to 18 months or so? Do we really NEED a new computer every 12 months or so? Or is it that we merely WANT a new one?
How many people get a new machine sooner than every 2, 3, or even 4 or more years? Business would be just as happy if they never had to upgrade. As long as their competitors couldn't either.
The manufactures have to stay in business, so they constantly upgrade. Growth, growth, growth.
But would it be so bad for the user if we could keep our machines and OS's for five years, and then upgrade to something MUCH better. Something that had been tested and reworked so that it was actually what it was supposed to be?
Not as much fun, no doubt, but certainly better.
You wouldn't be 65 years old and the CEO of a Fortune 500 company would you?
Originally posted by Mac The Fork
My concern was really with that specific toolbar customisation sheet. You'll notice that there are a number of duplicate entries, it's visually jumbled, there doesn't appear to be any organisation applied, and some of the labels aren't sufficiently verbal -- what does "Address" do? What does "Threads" do? People will learn the functions by exploration, but as long as Apple is bothering to label the buttons, there's no sense in being coy.
When it's considered on its own, I don't mind the theme so much. Some of the buttons look too small for their icons. It looks like the button height was chosen based on the 'arrow' icons -- Reply, Forward, Redirect, etc., without enough consideration for the more pictorial icons like Get Mail. The graphite colour weighs things down. It's acceptable, but not really worth it, in my opinion. The fact that there's a third theme, again diminishing the identity of the system for no apparent reason other than a disarrayed concept of aesthetics, is also bothersome. That's a more superficial point of view though; the real problem is the unwieldiness of the duplicate items, poor labels and lack of organisation that comprise the bulk of the design (of that sheet).
I'm betting that when 10.5 rolls around and Apple tweaks the GUI even more, that these new buttons and widgets in Tiger will be defended.
Most of these changes grow on us all. Some don't. I continue to look at the other side of the fence when pondering over these things. The grass still don't look greener over there, if ya know what I mean.
Originally posted by BuonRotto
What I've taken notice of the most are the subtle improvements to a lot of areas.
I would like to know more of course, but these are always the things that make it fun to upgrade. You might be working with the new OS for a few weeks or even months and suddenly you notice a small change, something that just feels nice.
I work with XP everyday. I still keep finding things that irritate me. Tiger will enhance the pain of these discoveries during the day as well as to the joy of the evening when I sit back in front of the new OS X.
Apple works fast.
Originally posted by AppleInsider
Article removed at the request of Apple Legal.
[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ]
Don't you think they're getting a little paranoid? I don't see Microsoft running around and removing articles that talk about a pre-release version of LongHorn.
I haven't seen such a closed-to-public company in a long time. Next think you'll know, they'll label stuff as "state secret" and persecute anyone that says/writes/thinks the name "Tiger".
Originally posted by kcmac
You wouldn't be 65 years old and the CEO of a Fortune 500 company would you?
No, I'm 55 years old and sold my half of my company last year. It's a commercial photo lab.
I first learned Fortran IV in 1966 in high school.
Big business is exactly what is killing MS at this moment. While Apple and Linux and the others can be fleet of foot or try to push the envelope, big business keeps a boot in MS's a$$. And anyone who works in a PC environment suffers for it.
I can see your point and those like it, but I would rather see where things can go, not linger in what we have.