Blu-ray vs. HD DVD (2007)

15681011233

Comments

  • Reply 141 of 4650
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gregmightdothat View Post


    Smash everything? I think you're thinking of Wii controllers there.











    Probably the MAIN reason I don't play VG's, because frankwoulddothat! That plus I'm just not that good as VG's.



  • Reply 142 of 4650
    elixirelixir Posts: 782member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post


    So your point rests on nothing but your personal opinion, people you've talked to, and other anecdotal crap? Great..just checking.



    maybe you should check out Time magazine, PC world, the New York Times,Washington Post and a slew of gaming magazines, sites, forums, and blogs to get a better understanding of what i'm talking about
  • Reply 143 of 4650
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Warner shoots and scores!







    Damn...winds of change







    w00t! Now we'll have three HD-ROM types, HD format problem solved???????????



    So HDTV's are flying off the shelves, I'll accept that, no problem there.



    But what percentage of those HDTV's are < 37"? I'd SWAG alot.



    How many of those < 37" HDTV's play 1080p native? Zero (and please don't count 23+" monitors here)?



    LCD's? Poor black levels?

    Pasma's? Native resolution?

    LDP's? Picture quality? (I don't know for sure, but I was never impressed with the picture quality/crispness of SD RP analog sets)



    Price points for HDTV's > 37"? Not cheap!



    And the SOP in most marketing/sales is to come in with high priced HW, skim the cream (those with the money who can afford the initial high price points), drop down a price point, skip cream again, repeat ad infinitum. So that several years after introduction, we have a fully populated tiered price structure (albeit at somewhat lower price points then when initially introduced, which is a good thing BTW).



    I'd also like to get past all the marketing hype, for instance, what are the historic annual DVD sales through 2006 (starting from 1997)? Are they really leveling off? I need hard numbers here! What precentage of those DVD sales were HD (both HD formats combined (fudge the HD format war and claims of victory))? I'd SWAG 0.01% for 2006!



    Talk about HD's potential Waterloo, talk about HD's potential Tower of Babel!



    And I'm going home!



  • Reply 144 of 4650
    jlljll Posts: 2,713member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Warner shoots and scores!



    Why? A hybrid disc only helps dual format studios. Why would Universal suddenly spend money on making BD masters? Why would Fox suddenly spend money on making HD DVD masters?



    Warner can save money and that's the only reason for them making the format - it's not to help you.
  • Reply 145 of 4650




    The next video format war – are you wondering what the truth is?



    I'd like to get my hands on this market research, it has DVD retail sales figures from 1997 thru 2005, it does appear that retail DVD sales may be peaking.



    HD DVD, Blu-ray Disc and the future of home entertainment: A strategic analysis



    But the PDF version cost $5,120 US!



    It was released in August, 2006, so it may be old news to you guys.



    See also, Does the European video market have a hi-def future?



    And, NA/US DVD Industry Data



    So it appears that the industry believes that additional HD-ROM sales of 15-20% over existing DVD sales might occur by 2010, but if DVD-ROM sales decrease 15-20% at the same time, sounds like a zero sum game to me!



  • Reply 146 of 4650
    glossgloss Posts: 506member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JLL View Post


    Why? A hybrid disc only helps dual format studios. Why would Universal suddenly spend money on making BD masters? Why would Fox suddenly spend money on making HD DVD masters?



    Warner can save money and that's the only reason for them making the format - it's not to help you.



    Studios would be stupid not to jump on this. Two formats, one disc = double the potential market.
  • Reply 147 of 4650
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,437member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JLL View Post


    Why? A hybrid disc only helps dual format studios. Why would Universal suddenly spend money on making BD masters? Why would Fox suddenly spend money on making HD DVD masters?



    Warner can save money and that's the only reason for them making the format - it's not to help you.



    Exactly...there's an impetus for eclusive studios to change their ways. Retailers will thank them as well because stocking one SKU of a HD title is always preferrable. The only negative is cost and maybe performance if their are unseen "gotchas"



    Microsoft may be interested in this as well because they have authoring tools that let a studio encode to VC-1 for HD DVD and then run that final encode through a converter tool that resets parameters for Blu-ray. Universal has been VC-1 so they could easily convert to Blu-ray with this tool.



    2007 will see the last gasps of this weak war as the Universals and perhaps hybrid discs assume command.
  • Reply 148 of 4650
    jlljll Posts: 2,713member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gloss View Post


    Studios would be stupid not to jump on this. Two formats, one disc = double the potential market.



    Only if those two markets are the same size. Plus the reasons why some studios didn't choose HD DVD or Blu-ray in the first place will still be valid.



    Dual format players can have a much larger impact IMHO.
  • Reply 149 of 4650
    bitemymacbitemymac Posts: 1,147member
    I could see the benefit of having dual disc on paper, but in reality it may only be beneficial as long as the cost of the content would stay the same or lower. However, it's likely to have the prices jacked up for such dual disc and no J6P will go near it. For example, I have few combo HD-DVD titles and I've never tried the SD-DVD side of the disc. I did pay 30% extra than the normal price usually I pay and still bitter about paying more.



    I think people are forgeting that the ultimate format war is against the SD-DVD, but not just between BD vs. HD-DVD. The dual disc may remedy the needs of BD vs. HD-DVD with possible added cost, but how does it help win against SD-DVD when the cost is added?



    I think the dual disc movie titles would cost at least $30-$35 on the street with $45-$50 retail tag and this is no where near the price J6P would pay for a newly released movie. Well.... online download service here I come...
  • Reply 150 of 4650
    jlljll Posts: 2,713member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Microsoft may be interested in this as well because they have authoring tools that let a studio encode to VC-1 for HD DVD and then run that final encode through a converter tool that resets parameters for Blu-ray. Universal has been VC-1 so they could easily convert to Blu-ray with this tool.



    They could do that today.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    2007 will see the last gasps of this weak war as the Universals and perhaps hybrid discs assume command.



    If universal players "assume command", Total HD aren't needed at all. Let's see the price of both too.
  • Reply 151 of 4650
    marzetta7marzetta7 Posts: 1,323member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bitemymac View Post


    I could see the benefit of having dual disc on paper, but in reality it may only be beneficial as long as the cost of the content would stay the same or lower. However, it's likely to have the prices jacked up for such dual disc and no J6P will go near it. For example, I have few combo HD-DVD titles and I've never tried the SD-DVD side of the disc. I did pay 30% extra than the normal price usually I pay and still bitter about paying more.



    I think people are forgeting that the ultimate format war is against the SD-DVD, but not just between BD vs. HD-DVD. The dual disc may remedy the needs of BD vs. HD-DVD with possible added cost, but how does it help win against SD-DVD when the cost is added?



    I think the dual disc movie titles would cost at least $30-$35 on the street with $45-$50 retail tag and this is no where near the price J6P would pay for a newly released movie. Well.... online download service here I come...



    I'm in actual agreement with you here. I just don't see this hybrid disc taking off. Personally, I just see it as a way for Warner to try and garner mass royalties from the discs themselves, not so much helping out the ol consumer. I wonder how many companies they've planned on sharing this tech with or is it simply a possible greedy avenue for them to get rich.
  • Reply 152 of 4650
    glossgloss Posts: 506member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JLL View Post


    Dual format players can have a much larger impact IMHO.



    Then again, that's placing the onus on the consumer rather than the studios. I guess it depends who you think deserves to suffer because of this whole mess.



    I'm happy either way, but I think they're both pleasant developments.
  • Reply 153 of 4650
    marzetta7marzetta7 Posts: 1,323member
    There's a new video on the playb3yond website (at least new to me). Check it out, it's pretty sweet...



    www.playb3yond.com



    Click on the MultiDemensional link at the top.
  • Reply 154 of 4650
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 18,026member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Elixir View Post


    maybe you should check out Time magazine, PC world, the New York Times,Washington Post and a slew of gaming magazines, sites, forums, and blogs to get a better understanding of what i'm talking about





    How do those publications have anything to do with current PS3 stock? Go check Wal-Mart and Target and Amazon and Circuit City and Best Buy and you'll see what I'm talking about. As of now, there is very little stock out there. When a shipment comes in, its gone in short order.



    You made a highly dubious claim that you can't back up. You made it because you go to bed and pray every night that the PS3 fails and the Wii succeeds. I've personally got better things to do with my time, but whatever floats your boat. Just don't come in here and start making stupid and outrageous claims and then tell others they're wrong.
  • Reply 155 of 4650
    marzetta7marzetta7 Posts: 1,323member
    Lacie Goes Blu-ray...



    http://www.macworld.com/news/2007/01/04/lacie/index.php



    Quote:

    LaCie on Thursday announced six new peripherals for Macs and PCs, include new hard disk drive models and what LaCie describes as the first external Blu-ray drive for Macs and Windows that?s available worldwide.



    The LaCie d2 Blu-ray Drive comes with Roxio?s Toast software and includes FireWire and USB 2.0 interfaces. The drive records, rewrites and reads 25GB and 50GB BD-R and BD-RE discs, as well as DVD-DL and CD-RW. One 50GB disc is included. The drive can be pre-ordered for $1,149.



    The Quadra hard drive features USB 2.0, FireWire 400, FireWire 800 and external serial ATA (eSATA) interfaces. It includes the LaCie ?Shortcut? button which will automatically activate applications, documents or backup files when pressed. It?s bundled with EMC?s Retrospect Express backup software for both Mac and Windows. It costs $299 for a 500GB drive.



    The d2 Safe Hard Drive uses biometric access (a fingerprint lock) for security. It comes in LaCie?s d2 triple interface chassis, with FireWire 800, 400 and USB 2.0, and supports 128-bit AES data encryption; it also uses a chain lock port. The drive can support up to 10 fingerprints; the fingerprint with lock or unlock the drive. LaCie?s 1-Click Backup software is included. The drive costs $299 for a 500GB model.



    The Ethernet Disk mini and Ethernet Big Disk are both network storage disks designed for small office/home office use. They?re designed to provide networkable storage with access through FTP, HTTP and home wired or wireless connections. You can also use one of two USB ports for personal hard drive use instead. Also included is LaCie?s 1-Click Backup software. Prices range from $199 to $499 for capacities ranging from 250GB to 1 terabyte (TB).



    The Ethernet Disk RAID is a RAID Level 5-based network storage drive that completes with system backup and recovery software for Windows, file sharing for Mac OS X, Windows and Linux clients, RAID 0, 1, 10 and 5+spare-based support, four hot-swappable SATA drives and other capabilities. The system comes equipped with two Gigabit Ethernet LAJ ports, can act as a DHCP server, and also features two USB 2.0 ports for adding additional storage.



    LaCie?s FireWire Speakers require no AC adapter, and connect using a computer?s FireWire port. The built-in cable provides power, and the speakers use 8-watt minimum output. They?re available today for $79.



    All of LaCie?s new products will debut at next week?s Macworld Conference & Expo in booth S2226.



    I wonder if there will be any more Apple related announcements regarding Blu-ray starting next week. Time will tell, and it will be awesome if Apple released new Mac Pros with Blu-ray drives.
  • Reply 156 of 4650
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post


    You made a highly dubious claim that you can't back up. You made it because you go to bed and pray every night that the PS3 fails and the Wii succeeds. I've personally got better things to do with my time, but whatever floats your boat. Just don't come in here and start making stupid and outrageous claims and then tell others they're wrong.



    check out this article:



    http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/04/so...ns-of-slowing/





    I so want BD to succeed because BD simply is a better technology than HD DVD, but it's not going to happen until Sony lower the prices on the PS3 in the U.S. at least $100 like they did for Japan and start rolling out games that is noticeably more impressive than from the Xbox 360. SCEA president Jack Tretton has stated there would not be a price drop any time soon.



    The last straw for PS3 would be its exclusive gaming titles, but many supposedly exclusive titles like Assassins and Tekken 5 are no more. I am afraid if the PS3 keeps stumbling in sales, the big exclusives like Metal Gear, Final Fantasy and Devil May Cry 4 may be ported to the Xbox 360 as well, then it would be all over for them.



    And when PS3 loses, BD will most likely lose as well unless someone in the BD camp comes out with BD player under $300.
  • Reply 157 of 4650
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Elixir View Post


    you couldn't get a 360 well into march after launch, bundle or not.



    getting your hands on a ps3 seems to be a lot easier



    Yes, but it was still widely available for 9 months longer than the PS3.



    Stating that the 360 has more titles than the PS3 is no way to back up an argument.
  • Reply 158 of 4650
    shetlineshetline Posts: 4,695member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ginerd View Post


    I so want BD to succeed because BD simply is a better technology than HD DVD...



    BD has more capacity. I don't think that automatically makes it "better" technology. Is there anything else you think is better about BD besides potential capacity?



    Even with its special protective spin coat, the vulnerability of the shallow data layer of a BD bothers me. Apart from a BD disc becoming permanently damaged, BD playback is more susceptible to failure due to dust, fingerprints, vibration, and disc warpage. I appreciate the more conservative, more forgiving engineering of HD DVD, which also better leverages the capabilities of existing DVD pressing facilities.



    And while the studios might love it, as a consumer I certainly don't consider BD's greater effort (whether it eventually pays off or not) at DRM a plus.



    I purchased a Toshiba HD DVD player a couple of weeks ago, and a few HD DVD discs, not because I felt certain that HD DVD would win, but because I preferred the technology, I felt things were leaning a little in favor of HD DVD, I wanted a new toy, and because -- as has turned out to be correct with LG's announcement today -- I was beginning to feel that the format war was going to drag on long enough to encourage the production of universal HD players.



    Now my worries about building a library of HD discs in a dead-end format are greatly reduced. If LG does a decent job with their first universal player, I'll probably buy one right away, sell my Toshiba on eBay, and then start buying discs in either format, with a preference toward HD DVD, at least in the near term, for titles available in both formats.
  • Reply 159 of 4650
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 18,026member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ginerd View Post


    check out this article:



    http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/04/so...ns-of-slowing/





    I so want BD to succeed because BD simply is a better technology than HD DVD, but it's not going to happen until Sony lower the prices on the PS3 in the U.S. at least $100 like they did for Japan and start rolling out games that is noticeably more impressive than from the Xbox 360. SCEA president Jack Tretton has stated there would not be a price drop any time soon.



    The last straw for PS3 would be its exclusive gaming titles, but many supposedly exclusive titles like Assassins and Tekken 5 are no more. I am afraid if the PS3 keeps stumbling in sales, the big exclusives like Metal Gear, Final Fantasy and Devil May Cry 4 may be ported to the Xbox 360 as well, then it would be all over for them.



    And when PS3 loses, BD will most likely lose as well unless someone in the BD camp comes out with BD player under $300.



    I checked that tracking site and I frankly don't find it credible. It lists like 6 stores with it in stock. I will bet real money that it's the bundled version.
  • Reply 160 of 4650
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 18,026member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by shetline View Post


    BD has more capacity. I don't think that automatically makes it "better" technology. Is there anything else you think is better about BD besides potential capacity?



    Even with its special protective spin coat, the vulnerability of the shallow data layer of a BD bothers me. Apart from a BD disc becoming permanently damaged, BD playback is more susceptible to failure due to dust, fingerprints, vibration, and disc warpage. I appreciate the more conservative, more forgiving engineering of HD DVD, which also better leverages the capabilities of existing DVD pressing facilities.



    And while the studios might love it, as a consumer I certainly don't consider BD's greater effort (whether it eventually pays off or not) at DRM a plus.



    I purchased a Toshiba HD DVD player a couple of weeks ago, and a few HD DVD discs, not because I felt certain that HD DVD would win, but because I preferred the technology, I felt things were leaning a little in favor of HD DVD, I wanted a new toy, and because -- as has turned out to be correct with LG's announcement today -- I was beginning to feel that the format war was going to drag on long enough to encourage the production of universal HD players.



    Now my worries about building a library of HD discs in a dead-end format are greatly reduced. If LG does a decent job with their first universal player, I'll probably buy one right away, sell my Toshiba on eBay, and then start buying discs in either format, with a preference toward HD DVD, at least in the near term, for titles available in both formats.



    Are you sure your concerns about the "vulnerability" of the data are actually an issue? That sounds pretty theoretical to me. I'm asking because I really don't know.
Sign In or Register to comment.