Apple's Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard to retail for $29 in September

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  • Reply 101 of 124
    pbpb Posts: 4,255member
    Probably I missed it, but what about Rosetta? Is it going to be included or not in Snow Leopard?
  • Reply 102 of 124
    ksecksec Posts: 1,569member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by columbus View Post


    Yes I have tested it, although not the multi-touch features as I don't have the hardware.



    That is one of the ares that I think looks exciting, along with the cleaned up task bar and window features.



    But your analysis is way out: Things like the updates to Wordpad and Paint - well these are long overdue, considering the subtle refinements and updates Apple has made to all their bundled applications during the lifetime of OS X.



    Here's a feature list for Snow Leopard (and Apple is not really talking up user facing features):

    - New Dock with Exposé and updated contextual menus

    - Updated Exposé window management (spring loaded, minimised windows show in exposé)

    - Live icon manipulation and preview, icon zoom

    - QuickLook in open/save dialogs

    - Updated Preview with annotations

    - The new stacks concept (added in Leopard) now allows for navigation

    - Create your own system wide services (Windows has no such concept) which are now displayed contextually

    - System wide auto-correct, text substitutions and data dectectors

    - Thesaurus

    - Built in screen recording

    - Built in video editing in QuickTime and sharing with Quicktime

    - Many accessibility improvements (braille device support, web spots, voiceover trackpad control)



    That's ignoring the faster startups, faster shutdowns, smaller footprint etc.



    The idea that Windows 7 makes Snow Leopard look like a service pack is laughable. All Snow Leopard makes Windows 7 look like is bad value for money.



    Overall that list above isn't really that impressive as many features were in Leopard and earlier versions of Mac OS X.

    New Taskbar = Exposé Dock (SL)

    New Window Controls = Exposé enhancements (SL)

    virtual folders = Smart Folders (L)

    Complete new network connection ui = WiFi siginal strength in WiFi connection UI (SL)

    Complete new ui standard for apps = Standard NS Toolbar

    New versions of Paint and WordPad = New versions of TextEdit, Preview, Mail, iCal, Quicktime Address Book, iChat, Safari (with crash protection) etc.

    hardware accelerated 2d graphics = Quartz Extreme

    GPU acceleration for apps = Open CL



    Edit: Not to mention Apple will be including all new and updated developer tools with Snow Leopard, whereas Microsoft will be charging up to many hundreds of dollars for their equivalents (apart from the Express editions).



    Edit again: Exchange, I didn't mention Exchange support, something which Windows 7 certainly won't support out the box.



    That is why i always have problem understanding Apple's pricing system.



    $29 for all of those?? Its a STEAL!.



    It must be the calculation of owing an Apple Laptop that has already subsidized the cost of OS development.
  • Reply 103 of 124
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,665member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Solar View Post


    Microsoft is all about choice!



    Heh. I almost posted exactly this.



    Quote:

    The "Snow Leopard is a Service Pack" meme is already annoying and i fear it's not going to go away any time soon. I'm betting it's going to be the #1 troll talking point related to SL



    Meh. The idea of various OS X releases being "service packs" has been a stable of PC chauvinism for a while. It's a twofer-- you can claim that Mac software is a poor value while forcing the argument into Microsoft-centric terminology, as if Apple were just an imperfect Windows client. Never mind that "service pack" is purely an MS marketing label, and has no meaning whatsoever outside of that context.



    PC chauvinists are like the ugly Americans of the computer world-- self satisfied, certain that they are the very definition of "normal", and completely unwilling to pay any attention to local custom or language when they venture forth from their strip malls and suburban tract houses.



    Talking to such people is like having a red-faced guy in bermuda shorts shouting at you because he's convinced that volume is the only barrier to driving his point home amongst the woefully ignorant locals.
  • Reply 104 of 124
    aglaeaaglaea Posts: 17member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post


    I don't see 10.6 competing with or stealing Windows 7's thunder.



    Windows 7 is being marketed as a major new OS and OS X 10.6 doesn't offer anything new or exciting for the consumer that you can see on the outside.



    To me there is a contradiction on how it's being presented and actuality. Where Windows 7 is presented as a new OS and will have a premium price, it appears to be a Vista make-over what I read about it (and I'm no Windows expert, so who will extend on this?), whereas Snow Leopard, which is stil a .x upgrade, is practically given away as 'fine tuning', but look at the impact:

    - FULL 64-bit support, including that for developers (64-bit made idiot proof),

    - support for GPU use in regular (e.g. non graphical) tasks,

    - 50% footprint reduction (!),

    - Safari plug-in sandboxing

    - etc., etc.

    The truth is out there: Windows 7 is a limited update to Vista and Snow Leopard features some great innovations that will enhance the user experience.



    The irony of course is that a more compact OS that could run great on limited hardware will not run on limited Apple hardware (G4/G5), although from a business point of view this is totally understandable. I'm curious how well Snow Leopard works on netbooks and old Intel CPUs...
  • Reply 105 of 124
    aglaeaaglaea Posts: 17member
    To me the 'service pack' way to act of Microsoft is marketing to keep users from getting the full blow of what is actually changing in the OS. I've seen some update lists of these service packs and some are really complete overhauls of parts of the system. To me it's: "Hey, let's say it's a big bug fix instead of that we gave them a non-finished product that we are completing with this major update."
  • Reply 106 of 124
    jonnyboyjonnyboy Posts: 525member
    surprised to see no news/discussion of major interface changes
  • Reply 107 of 124
    tiadimundotiadimundo Posts: 153member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Aglaea View Post


    To me there is a contradiction on how it's being presented and actuality. Where Windows 7 is presented as a new OS and will have a premium price, it appears to be a Vista make-over what I read about it (and I'm no Windows expert, so who will extend on this?)



    Well the truth is that neither Snow Leopard nor Seven represent a new generation of their platforms. But Windows 7 will be targeted more to the XP users. And for them, who haven't really given Vista a chance, may be shocked how good a Windows version actually can be (I know people who tested 7 on their old XP-machines and where indeed impressed). A lot of Vista features will be new to them when they first discover them in 7. The jump from XP to 7 is also higher than the update from Tiger to Snow Leopard.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Aglaea View Post


    To me the 'service pack' way to act of Microsoft is marketing to keep users from getting the full blow of what is actually changing in the OS. I've seen some update lists of these service packs and some are really complete overhauls of parts of the system. To me it's: "Hey, let's say it's a big bug fix instead of that we gave them a non-finished product that we are completing with this major update."



    There are also new technologies and therefore new features. I just say full Blu-Ray support with Vista SP2 for f r e e
  • Reply 108 of 124
    sport73sport73 Posts: 438member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jonnyboy View Post


    surprised to see no news/discussion of major interface changes



    I think the "Marble" interface is still coming in Snow Leopard; it's the only reason I can see waiting until September to release an OS that many are saying is 'code complete'. In the next few weeks Apple will release the UI updates to developers for testing/implementation, and accompany it with a Steve-note on a new product (or Beatles iTunes availability) where he showcases the refinements.



    They basically said in the presentation that Snow Leopard was the last of the big cats. Refine the code, trim it down, incorporate new 'building block' technologies, and add a layer of polish to the UI...Why? Because it will be the last OS release until late 2011; when Apple releases OS11. OS11 will be a major new update taking advantage of the core technologies and stability achieved in Snow Leopard, but with sweeping new features including full multi-touch support, new 3D desktop options, and much more.
  • Reply 109 of 124
    a_greera_greer Posts: 4,594member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post


    http://www.apple.com/macosx/specs.html



    Upgrading from Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger.

    If your Intel-based Mac is running Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger, purchase the Mac Box Set (when available), which is a single, affordable package that includes Mac OS X v10.6 Snow Leopard; iLife ’09, with the latest versions of iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iWeb, and iDVD; and iWork ’09, Apple’s productivity suite for home and office including Pages, Numbers, and Keynote.




    why buy the 09 apps in Sept-Oct when the new 2010 releases drop in Jan or Feb every year?



    If I were advising a customer who uses intel 10.4 I would recomend the following:



    buy a new HDD, todays HDDs are bigger and faster than 3 years ago, buy ram because maxing out the ram is the cheapest boost you can do, buy an SATA to usb or FW device and pick up a $29 copy of snow leopard and do as follows:



    put the new hdd and ram in and install 10.6 to the blank disk, use the USB kit to connect the old drive and copy all needed files over, then wipe the old drive and use it for time machine. this will get you a much better system for about $100. and if you do want ilife, you can just install the version that came on your system disk untilll the 2010 versions of iwork and ilife ship in Jan.
  • Reply 110 of 124
    pbpb Posts: 4,255member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Sport73 View Post


    I think the "Marble" interface is still coming in Snow Leopard; it's the only reason I can see waiting until September to release an OS that many are saying is 'code complete'. In the next few weeks Apple will release the UI updates to developers for testing/implementation



    What makes you to believe so? Apple's own page on SL shows the same old blue scroll bars for the Finder windows (see the Time Machine picture). Although they carefully hide the window scrollbar in the Finder section of the same page, we can still see the blue Aqua theme in the selected items. I don't see why they would change this now that it is displayed publicly.
  • Reply 111 of 124
    carmissimocarmissimo Posts: 837member
    I suspect the reason Apple has decided to price the new OS so low is that by doing so, the company's sales numbers will be better between now and the September launch. Otherwise, you have to know that some people would hold off on buying a new computer in order to save money by buying one with the new OS included.



    $29, on the other hand, is a really small amount and as such, no one would put off buying a new machine.



    Considering the current economic climate, it's a smart move. Don't know if Apple will keep it at $29 but it certainly makes a lot of sense right now.



    Also, it's in Apple's best interests to have their customers convert over to the new OS as quickly as possible to avoid the confusion of having two OSs out there running fundamentally different base code.
  • Reply 112 of 124
    chris_cachris_ca Posts: 2,543member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post


    http://www.apple.com/macosx/specs.html



    Upgrading from Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger.

    If your Intel-based Mac is running Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger, purchase the Mac Box Set (when available), which is a single, affordable package that includes Mac OS X v10.6 Snow Leopard; iLife ?09, with the latest versions of iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iWeb, and iDVD; and iWork ?09, Apple?s productivity suite for home and office including Pages, Numbers, and Keynote.




    Okay, but that is not the $29 upgrade, which is what a_greer asked about.

    "They didnt mention a price to upgrade from Tiger, so will Tiger users on the early Macbooks be able to upgrade for $29?"
  • Reply 113 of 124
    rokkenrokken Posts: 236member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post


    I suspect the reason Apple has decided to price the new OS so low is that by doing so, the company's sales numbers will be better between now and the September launch. Otherwise, you have to know that some people would hold off on buying a new computer in order to save money by buying one with the new OS included.



    $29, on the other hand, is a really small amount and as such, no one would put off buying a new machine.



    Considering the current economic climate, it's a smart move. Don't know if Apple will keep it at $29 but it certainly makes a lot of sense right now.



    Also, it's in Apple's best interests to have their customers convert over to the new OS as quickly as possible to avoid the confusion of having two OSs out there running fundamentally different base code.



    Even if they priced it at $129, the costumers who buy new Macs between now and the September launch only need to pay something around $9 to update so your first point is irrelevant IMO.



    However, I agree it is in their best interest to have the majority of their user base upgrade to Snow Leopard, given it lays foundation for future technologies, and by pricing it at $29, which is really a steal for such performance improvement, it can make it.



    In the meantime, since Microsoft loves to criticise Apple's pricing that much, I am really looking forward to how much they price Windows 7. The version I am talking about is not some basic version, Home version etc., but the version comes with full functionality like Snow Leopard delivers.
  • Reply 114 of 124
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,428member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rokken View Post


    However, I agree it is in their best interest to have the majority of their user base upgrade to Snow Leopard, given it lays foundation for future technologies, and by pricing it at $29, which is really a steal for such performance improvement, it can make it.




    +1



    If you want developers to take advantage of 64-bit and GCD and OpenCL and QTX you need to create a viable market. $29 adds money to the til for Apple and gives value to Snow Leopard. This is about forward momentum. Snow Leopard is unlike any OS X version we've had. It resets the baseline.
  • Reply 115 of 124
    flounderflounder Posts: 2,674member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post


    I suspect the reason Apple has decided to price the new OS so low is that by doing so, the company's sales numbers will be better between now and the September launch. Otherwise, you have to know that some people would hold off on buying a new computer in order to save money by buying one with the new OS included.



    $29, on the other hand, is a really small amount and as such, no one would put off buying a new machine.



    That explanation doesn't make sense because everyone buying a mac between yesterday and the day SL is released can upgrade for $10.
  • Reply 116 of 124
    columbuscolumbus Posts: 282member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Apple leveraged the GPU with Quartz Extreme - Microsoft leveraged it with Aero



    Five years later. Except even then the performance was terrible, even though they (MS) had far, far faster hardware to play with.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Yes they are overdue but the updates are huge! For the first time standard apps will not have menus and toolbars anymore. It's like Vista's Explorer killed the old Lisa OS era menus by introducing a streamlined contextual command bar and Office 2007 introduced the contextual Ribbon, now we will see this paradigm in a lot more third party apps. A lot of people will not believe but Microsoft is leading innovation here in UI design. Snow Leopard is still Lisa OS (old menus) + OpenStep (the Dock) + Exposé.



    The reason Leopard has old style menus is because they work and have worked for years. Its very easy to scan down a list to see options.



    And lets not pretend Apple hasn't made refinements. Unlike in Windows the menu items are indexed and searchable. You can also customise keyboard shortcuts (and add new ones) for many apps using the Keyboard Preference Pane.



    Here's what I think of the ribbon:

    [1] Its a jumbled mess of arbitrarily sized icons and text arranged haphazardly across the toolbar.

    [2] Screens are wide, not tall, anything stealing horizontal space from the content is a bad thing. The ribbon steals lots of space.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Btw I forgot to mention Device Stage and Jump Lists before. Very nice and huge features



    Jump Lists… well put the bunting out! OS X has had contextual menus above dock items for years and very few people use them. I doubt many people will use jump lists either. Device stage looks promising though.
  • Reply 117 of 124
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post


    Okay, but that is not the $29 upgrade, which is what a_greer asked about.

    "They didnt mention a price to upgrade from Tiger, so will Tiger users on the early Macbooks be able to upgrade for $29?"



    Using your fingers and checking out the price from Tiger to Leopard Pack one should use their brain and realize that it won't be $29 from Tiger to Snow Leopard with iLife '09 plus iWorks '09.
  • Reply 118 of 124
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,665member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by columbus View Post


    Five years later. Except even then the performance was terrible, even though they (MS) had far, far faster hardware to play with.







    The reason Leopard has old style menus is because they work and have worked for years. Its very easy to scan down a list to see options.



    And lets not pretend Apple hasn't made refinements. Unlike in Windows the menu items are indexed and searchable. You can also customise keyboard shortcuts (and add new ones) for many apps using the Keyboard Preference Pane.



    Here's what I think of the ribbon:

    [1] Its a jumbled mess of arbitrarily sized icons and text arranged haphazardly across the toolbar.

    [2] Screens are wide, not tall, anything stealing horizontal space from the content is a bad thing. The ribbon steals lots of space.







    Jump Lists? well put the bunting out! OS X has had contextual menus above dock items for years and very few people use them. I doubt many people will use jump lists either. Device stage looks promising though.



    Not sure how this came to be but you're attributing quotes to Murch that were posted by TiAdiMundo.
  • Reply 119 of 124
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,665member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TiAdiMundo View Post


    A lot of Vista features will be new to them when they first discover them in 7. The jump from XP to 7 is also higher than the update from Tiger to Snow Leopard.



    Not surprising given the 8 year vs. 4 year gap between those two releases.



    Not sure that impressing your customers with a big leap forward because they largely ignored your last big leap forward and have been standing pat for 8 years is a huge win, however. I imagine that if most of Apple's customers had hung onto 10.1 till now and then went straight to Snow Leopard, they'd be pretty impressed as well.
  • Reply 120 of 124
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by webraider View Post


    Nope.. For the first time in my life I will not be buying an OS from Apple, nor will my next hardware purchase be an Apple until the have Full BluRay support. I mean Full. The pro apps getter be able to author BluRay, I better be able to play it and iDVD better have that functioning added too. To have to boot into Windows to run a BluRay is absolutely Pathetic Apple. It's very possible my next machine will be a PC. At least MS tries to support STANDARD technologies.



    you can burn to Blue-Ray media via Toast Titanium for OSX and while your dusting the HORSE CRAP from your eyes & ears- try reading up on the Micro$hit BLOATWARE and un-usable crap they keep putting out for years... then repost here...



    Micro$hit (as always- are just changing the curtains) and not re-doing the entire home..

    can you say EXTREME MAKEOVER!!???? thats what Apple did when they released MAC OS X

    they got rid of the old software and CREATED a new and better user experience-

    and they only have ONE flavor of the Operating System and for only $29. to upgrade to SNOW LEOPARD

    not the hundreds of dollars Micro$hit makes you pay to get the FULL use of their OS



    Lets not forget what VISTA stands for either= Viruses_Inevitable_Stick_To_Apple

    and the fact that PC vendors Like HP & DELL have struck agreements with Micro$hit to allow them to go back to XP on the PC's they want to sell you because of the problems with VISTA... "who does that??"



    (when will people just educate themselves on this stuff and just get over it and join the NOW Crowd instead of the WOW crowd... i give Apple (5) years time to take over this M$ windows mess...



    here is an interesting article i came across on line last night.. take some time to read it even though it might not be completely clear to you as far as the technical terms , you should still be able to get an idea of what i mean..



    The Truth and the Consequences of using a M$ WINDOZE PC



    http://rixstep.com/2/20090326,00.shtml
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