As a moderator of these forums, you really should be above personal attacks.
I'll agree that there are some products coming out like this one from OWLE that are currently unique to the iPhone. However, especially as a long time Mac users, many of these products simply attempt to overcome the one size fits all nature of Apple solutions. Either that or they help someone already rationalize a purchase. I can't imagine anyone passing up their first choice of phone though due to the ability to buy a $99 kit to make their phone attempt to match an inexpensive camcorder. The iPhone has plenty of attachable battery packs that no other phone has as well. That is to overcome the Apple refusal to make a replaceable battery. It isn't an advantage but more like an attempt to address a limitation.
They are lame remarks. I'm not attacking you, just what you said, which is perfectly fine.
That's a unique product, and will likely find some use.
It's interesting that we now have had two major motion pictures made with purely amateur equipment that made hundreds of millions of dollars. The last one, I forget the name, just cost $15,000 to make. So this might find some use.
Yo are picking what you think are, to you, the worst choices. but the fact that there are many choices is what's important. Attempting to find fault with a few jut makes your case weaker.
All phones with removable batteries are no better than the iPhone with a non removable one.
I can use a battery pack to add to my phone while I'm still in the process of using it. In the middle of a call, for instance.
What phone do you have with a removable battery pack that allows you to do that?
And these battery packs, most of which offer more than the juice of the built in pack, cost no more than, or no more than a few dollars more than a replaceable battery pack from other manufacturers.
Advantage iPhone.
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The iPhone has its 3.2Mp camera as an example. Apple may improve it next year or they may not. I'm leaning towards not since it was upgraded last year. Droid already has 5 MP and several other Android phone manufacturers are already aiming much higher than that. That will be the flexibility of that platform. If someone wants to produce a phone that is thicker with better MP and optics, someone can choose that and if someone wants no keyboard and 5 MP camera for $99, someone can produce that as well. It isn't one size fits all like Apple. I'm not claiming that hurts Apple, just noting that many of the products attempting to deal with that one size solution are not an advantage to Apple or a disadvantage to others.
And interestingly enough, so far, none of the phone cameras with 5 MP sensors have been reviewed to have better pictures than the one in the #GS. Even as far as resolution goes, most seem to be no better.
5MP is a joke so far for these tiny sensors. The flashes are also marginally useful. Once you move more that three feet away, they do nothing.
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What really is interesting is why focus on the Droid alone or the Droid at all? Android is the platform that Apple has to worry about. It would be like noting Apple is okay because Asus only sold X number of PC's while ignoring Dell, HP, and others. I noted that I need three things to make the jump. Management software of some sort, an Audible.com client and perhaps I haven't investigated it enough but I want to use Yahoo in the native mail client. The Sense UI looks great and the $99 Droid Eris on Verizon is actually much more tempting to me right now than the Moto Droid. When it has 2.0 on it as well, it will be very hard to turn down.
The Droid is being pictured as the new iPhone killer. The new Jesus phone. just look at Verizon's commercials. They're the ones doing it, and its their phone here.
I don't think Apple has to worry about it. android isn't going to take over the market, just a minority of it, like Apple.
They will both be successful. But Android may break into several only vaguely compatible fiefs in a few years. Then we won't be talking about Android any more than we talk about Linux phones, which is what it's based upon. We'll be talking about Motorola phones, Verizon phones, HTC phones, etc.
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His point is valid. No one would claim that the MP3 app wouldn't work because the data has to be on the card. The phone can access unlimited data. The app limitation is being addressed and appears to be part of concerns about initiallys securing the phone. Apple has no clean bill of health here with iPhones being rickrolled and having notifications pop up begging for cash to secure them. Every platform has growing pains.
You can't get the data out of the app, and move it anywhere. He's wrong.
Not a single iPhone that wasn't jailbroken was Rickrolled. In fact, it MUST be jailbroken. In addition, you must be using SSH software, and too lazy to have changed the default passwords. Something that even routers come with.
So if you have a router or modem with the default user name as "admin", and the password as "user", you are pretty dumb if you don't immediately change it to something strong, or it will quickly be broken into. No difference.
As I've said, that "number of 100,000 estimates" you point to still all originate from Mark McKechnie at Broadpoint AmTech, Inc. The articles may be differently worded from each other, but the data still comes from a single point of origin. That's a fact. It's right in the second paragraph of the Bloomberg article you linked to.
My point wasn't to argue over the success of Droid (if that's how you want to take it, the so be it), just that Michael Cote made a very valid point and I am pretty much asking the same question he is. Does the 100,000 number take into account other ways of purchasing the Droid?
The only assumption I've made is that Best Buy and the other resellers have an independent line of stock than Verizon itself, thus allowing for more than 200,000 total Droid in stock. Which is just as fair as the assumption you're using that there were only 200,000 Droid period.
I think we should leave this for now, until either Motorola or Verizon decide to say something, or other more reliable numbers come out, as we're not going to settle this.
No, he doesn?t. When you your app has to quite small due to size limitations ands supporting fiels stored separately, it?s not only inconvenient, it?s unnatural for the average user. This will not make normal consumers happy if they have to install more files after the app install or if they remove the micro-SD card not realizing that the app is not stored internally. Smartphones geared toward geeks aren?t a real world focus. For Android to work for the average person you?ll see internal storage increase.
The average consumer with this phone is going to download the app from an online store and has no idea where the files are stored. The average consumer likely won't even touch the micro-SD card.
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PS: Apple?s bill of health with the iPhone is good. The iPhone security issue is from jailbroken devices with OpenSSH installed and the root password not changed. Without these three things entry is not had. Same goes for any PC with any OS. Why is this simple fact so hard?
It isn't hard and Apple is still responsible because people who are not fanboyz don't excuse the breach due to jailbreaking when Apple is the one responsible for the security breaches that allow jailbreaking in the first place.
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Originally Posted by melgross
They are lame remarks. I'm not attacking you, just what you said, which is perfectly fine.
I know your age and that said, grow up.
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That's a unique product, and will likely find some use.
A can opener bungee corded to a razor could find some use. It doesn't make it a viable product that will alter market outcomes. That was your contention so stop moving the goal posts.
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It's interesting that we now have had two major motion pictures made with purely amateur equipment that made hundreds of millions of dollars. The last one, I forget the name, just cost $15,000 to make. So this might find some use.
Some use.... you were claiming it would alter buying decisions.
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Yo are picking what you think are, to you, the worst choices. but the fact that there are many choices is what's important. Attempting to find fault with a few jut makes your case weaker.
What the hell are you talking about with many choices? Folks are still clamoring for their bluetooth gamepads, bluetooth keyboards, apple socket connectors for... you name it. Little has been done in this area. I'm not taking the worst of many examples. I'm taking the few examples available.
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All phones with removable batteries are no better than the iPhone with a non removable one.
I can use a battery pack to add to my phone while I'm still in the process of using it. In the middle of a call, for instance.
What phone do you have with a removable battery pack that allows you to do that?
And these battery packs, most of which offer more than the juice of the built in pack, cost no more than, or no more than a few dollars more than a replaceable battery pack from other manufacturers.
Advantage iPhone.
Your example is hilarious. All the other phones simply change the battery out before the call or after the call. There would be no need to sweat it in the middle of the call because they can REMOVE THE BATTERY. This is exactly what I noted before. You take a disadvantage and make it sound like an advantage.
Also my phones have all kept calls when being plugged into a charger. Thus any microUSB charger would accomplish the same thing just like this one here. So in answer to your question of what other phones could accomplish the same task, my answer would be every phone I have owned because all have allowed talking while being plugged into a charging source and since the source can also be a battery back just like the link I posted, the answer is all of them.
Advantage: People with a clue who don't have to resort to name calling to make a point.
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And interestingly enough, so far, none of the phone cameras with 5 MP sensors have been reviewed to have better pictures than the one in the #GS. Even as far as resolution goes, most seem to be no better.
5MP is a joke so far for these tiny sensors. The flashes are also marginally useful. Once you move more that three feet away, they do nothing.
I've read several reviews where it was claimed to match the iPhone and also several where it was claimed to be better.
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The Droid is being pictured as the new iPhone killer. The new Jesus phone. just look at Verizon's commercials. They're the ones doing it, and its their phone here.
Clearly Verizon wants to show that they have a good selection of smartphones to dissuade people from pondering a move to AT&T. Their advertising supports the Droid but also knocks the network.
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I don't think Apple has to worry about it. android isn't going to take over the market, just a minority of it, like Apple.
They will both be successful. But Android may break into several only vaguely compatible fiefs in a few years. Then we won't be talking about Android any more than we talk about Linux phones, which is what it's based upon. We'll be talking about Motorola phones, Verizon phones, HTC phones, etc.
Vaguely compatible? How will Apple not have the same problem while improving their platform? How is something going to be compatible with the original iPhone and whatever Apple has available in two years which will hopefully have double the screen resolution, 400% more powerful processor than the original and so forth?
One thing that will be most interesting is what you noted with vertical integration. Since you are allowed to install Android on so many more phone forms, people really could make a great camcorder and use it to run the phone add on or whatever. You really design a pro-audio device and run Android on it. That is one of the big advantages that Google is pressing and Apple should be addressing.
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You can't get the data out of the app, and move it anywhere. He's wrong.
Data in no form has to be within the app. Even thinking so is endorsing the iPhone model instead of addressing the Google cloud model. In that model the app would be small and would just go get all the recipes and whatever is necessary over the network.
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Not a single iPhone that wasn't jailbroken was Rickrolled. In fact, it MUST be jailbroken. In addition, you must be using SSH software, and too lazy to have changed the default passwords. Something that even routers come with.
So if you have a router or modem with the default user name as "admin", and the password as "user", you are pretty dumb if you don't immediately change it to something strong, or it will quickly be broken into. No difference.
...Apple is still responsible because people who are not fanboyz don't excuse the breach due to jailbreaking when Apple is the one responsible for the security breaches that allow jailbreaking in the first place.
No, they are not. No system is hack proof when you have the HW and OS in front of you. If you have taken the time to jailbreak your phone at the risk of voiding the warranty then you are responsible for any hacking, spyware or viruses it receives because of such action. Apple is responsible if their App Store leads to any of these as they are the ones control and okaying that method of entry.
By your argument people who due from using a hairdryer in the bath can hold the company responsible regardless of any warnings on the label because using a device outside of the intended use is the company?s fault, not the user?s.
When you stop making lame comments, it will be time to stop mentioning it.
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A can opener bungee corded to a razor could find some use. It doesn't make it a viable product that will alter market outcomes. That was your contention so stop moving the goal posts.
There are plenty of products that many people don't find useful, and that many others do. Whether you or I find a product to be useless to us isn't important.
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Some use.... you were claiming it would alter buying decisions.
For those who find the product useful, it will.
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What the hell are you talking about with many choices? Folks are still clamoring for their bluetooth gamepads, bluetooth keyboards, apple socket connectors for... you name it. Little has been done in this area. I'm not taking the worst of many examples. I'm taking the few examples available.
Those will come too. I've seen some prototypes. I don't know what the delay on individual products is.
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Your example is hilarious. All the other phones simply change the battery out before the call or after the call. There would be no need to sweat it in the middle of the call because they can REMOVE THE BATTERY. This is exactly what I noted before. You take a disadvantage and make it sound like an advantage.
It's funny to you because you want to stick to your statement. I've been on long calls where my plug in battery was very useful. There are times where you can't change out the battery before making a call. Or don't realize the call will go on for so long.
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Also my phones have all kept calls when being plugged into a charger. Thus any microUSB charger would accomplish the same thing just like this one here. So in answer to your question of what other phones could accomplish the same task, my answer would be every phone I have owned because all have allowed talking while being plugged into a charging source and since the source can also be a battery back just like the link I posted, the answer is all of them.
So what is your point then? You were the one talking about the advantages of changing the battery! With that, or any of the other models out, your phone still has no advantage. But there are specialized models just for the iPhone that are much better than that.
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Advantage: People with a clue who don't have to resort to name calling to make a point.
Yes, and when you get a clue, let us know.
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I've read several reviews where it was claimed to match the iPhone and also several where it was claimed to be better.
Most have said it was about the same, or worse.
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Clearly Verizon wants to show that they have a good selection of smartphones to dissuade people from pondering a move to AT&T. Their advertising supports the Droid but also knocks the network.
Of course. But don't say it's just iPhone fans trying to set the Droid up as a potential iPhone killer. Its clearly Verizon that's trying that.
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Vaguely compatible? How will Apple not have the same problem while improving their platform? How is something going to be compatible with the original iPhone and whatever Apple has available in two years which will hopefully have double the screen resolution, 400% more powerful processor than the original and so forth?
Because, as I've now said numerous times, Apple's phones come out in succession. All the differing Android phones will be coming out at the same time. That's much more confusing. How are software developers going to let people know which phones are compatible or not? There will be too many of them.
There's another that discussed the branching off of Android as various companies start making them, but I can't find it now.
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One thing that will be most interesting is what you noted with vertical integration. Since you are allowed to install Android on so many more phone forms, people really could make a great camcorder and use it to run the phone add on or whatever. You really design a pro-audio device and run Android on it. That is one of the big advantages that Google is pressing and Apple should be addressing.
A major advantage Apple has is their 30 pin connector that allows close integration with the hardware. No other phone or player has anything like this. It's why we will see hardware add ons for Apple's devices that we won't see anywhere else.
We don't need a special device to run the iPhone OS for a camcorder, because it can be done directly.
Otherwise, I see no advantage using Android as an embedded OS. There are already plenty of Linux based embedded OS's for that purpose, and Android adds little to that space. Embedded OS's are feature limited to what that specialized device needs.
It's one thing having a phone that can be adapted for limited use for other functions, and it's become a computer to power these other bits. But to make a bit with the OS doesn't make sense.
Why would a camcorder need Android? What would Android do for it that a more specialized Linux distro couldn't, remembering that Android IS a Linux distro?
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Data in no form has to be within the app. Even thinking so is endorsing the iPhone model instead of addressing the Google cloud model. In that model the app would be small and would just go get all the recipes and whatever is necessary over the network.
I'm not sure why we HAVE to endorse the Google cloud model. I see an advantage for it in the future if they can fix the reliability and security problems. And if they will promise to never use your information for anything else, which they will not do, because that's the entire purpose for Google having it in their servers in the first place.
Meanwhile, all my apps that need to can access information over the net. We don't need Google's model to do that.
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Who's fault is it the iPhone can be jailbroken?
What does that have to do with people screwing themselves up by doing it? That's their fault, not Apple's.
No, they are not. No system is hack proof when you have the HW and OS in front of you. If you have taken the time to jailbreak your phone at the risk of voiding the warranty then you are responsible for any hacking, spyware or viruses it receives because of such action. Apple is responsible if their App Store leads to any of these as they are the ones control and okaying that method of entry.
By your argument people who due from using a hairdryer in the bath can hold the company responsible regardless of any warnings on the label because using a device outside of the intended use is the company?s fault, not the user?s.
Bad analogies don't fix bad reasoning. The iPhone is not secure in the first place. The fact that some uses that lack of security to render it even less secure doesnt excuse the initial security breach.
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Originally Posted by melgross
When you stop making lame comments, it will be time to stop mentioning it.
Oh gee, I'm rubber and you are glue, it bounces off of me and back onto you. Don't worry, bad reasoning needs an assist with bad labels. Clearly you don't trust the merits of your arguments to persuade by themselves.
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There are plenty of products that many people don't find useful, and that many others do. Whether you or I find a product to be useless to us isn't important.
Thanks for sharing but no one claimed you had to find anything useful.
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For those who find the product useful, it will.
The contention was that these add-ons would alter buying decisions. That contention has been left unproven. Thanks for playing.
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Those will come too. I've seen some prototypes. I don't know what the delay on individual products is.
I'd say the lack of people ready to purchase them.
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It's funny to you because you want to stick to your statement. I've been on long calls where my plug in battery was very useful. There are times where you can't change out the battery before making a call. Or don't realize the call will go on for so long.
Again that is nice and plenty of people just plug in their car charge, wall charger or whatever. Again you claimed this as some sort of unique iPhone attribute when clearly it isn't.
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So what is your point then? You were the one talking about the advantages of changing the battery! With that, or any of the other models out, your phone still has no advantage. But there are specialized models just for the iPhone that are much better than that.
There are plenty of advantages. You can buy an extended battery and not have to worry about those long calls with double the capacity. You can work the phone through several hours at work, arrive home and simply swap for a fresh battery when running out for the evening. You've got a fresh start with no concerns at that point.
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Yes, and when you get a clue, let us know.
Thanks for the personal attack Mr. Moderator.
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Most have said it was about the same, or worse.
Don't forget that there is a video capture side to that equation as well.
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Of course. But don't say it's just iPhone fans trying to set the Droid up as a potential iPhone killer. Its clearly Verizon that's trying that.
Of course they are trying to blunt the momentum of the iPhone. It's almost like they are the number one cell provider watching number two get by with one giant crutch and if they can kick it out from under them, it will cause number two large problems.
It's almost like they are competing or something strange like that....
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Because, as I've now said numerous times, Apple's phones come out in succession. All the differing Android phones will be coming out at the same time. That's much more confusing. How are software developers going to let people know which phones are compatible or not? There will be too many of them.
They'll probably go to the Android App Store and download the apps just like iPhone users.
There's another that discussed the branching off of Android as various companies start making them, but I can't find it now.
I'm not too worried about Dan and his 14 word attempt at thought. Everything goes through growing pains. On the iPhone Apple already has the GS with compass and voice command support, MMS and tethering, the 3G with only MMS and tethering support, but not the first two features, and both run different processors, etc. People sort it out just fine in the end.
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A major advantage Apple has is their 30 pin connector that allows close integration with the hardware. No other phone or player has anything like this. It's why we will see hardware add ons for Apple's devices that we won't see anywhere else.
Perhaps at one point it was an advantage but between bluetooth, wifi, and microUSB being available is there seriously anything you can prove it can do that those cannot? I understand it is a legacy connector and people have used it to plug into cars and so forth but that doesn't mean other items cannot be made to do that as well.
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We don't need a special device to run the iPhone OS for a camcorder, because it can be done directly.
It can be done directly with microUSB as well. USB controls plenty of peripherals. The point is that no one would need to take the only option available and slap some ridiculous inelegant add-ons to it in an attempt to make something work. They could just make a differenet solution. If someone wants to make an Android phone with more incredible optics and a 12 MP camera but it ends up almost an inch thick, someone can. They don't have to take a half inch think iPhone and slap a whole second body onto it.
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Otherwise, I see no advantage using Android as an embedded OS. There are already plenty of Linux based embedded OS's for that purpose, and Android adds little to that space. Embedded OS's are feature limited to what that specialized device needs.
Marketing, brand awareness, there are two advantages right there.
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It's one thing having a phone that can be adapted for limited use for other functions, and it's become a computer to power these other bits. But to make a bit with the OS doesn't make sense.
Perhaps not to you, but the market is getting ready to offer netbooks and tablets with Android on it and 1 ghz snapdragon processors.
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Why would a camcorder need Android? What would Android do for it that a more specialized Linux distro couldn't, remembering that Android IS a Linux distro?
Why would an iPhone need a giant attachment in an attempt to make it a weak camcorder?
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I'm not sure why we HAVE to endorse the Google cloud model. I see an advantage for it in the future if they can fix the reliability and security problems. And if they will promise to never use your information for anything else, which they will not do, because that's the entire purpose for Google having it in their servers in the first place.
It doesn't really matter if you endorse it. You do a search on Safari on your iPhone and it goes to Google. You look at a YouTube video and that is Google. You add a gmail account and that is Google. You look up maps and also businesses, addresses and directions and that is Google. Your phone apps that have ads in the from Admob, that is now Google.
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Meanwhile, all my apps that need to can access information over the net. We don't need Google's model to do that.
I think you fail to see that it is still Google's model, just being emulated by smaller and likely less capable sources.
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What does that have to do with people screwing themselves up by doing it? That's their fault, not Apple's.
Wrong. Apple is responsible for securing the iPhone. Secondary breaches are still the fault of Apple's inability to stop the primary breach.
Bad analogies don't fix bad reasoning. The iPhone is not secure in the first place. The fact that some uses that lack of security to render it even less secure doesnt excuse the initial security breach.
Oh gee, I'm rubber and you are glue, it bounces off of me and back onto you. Don't worry, bad reasoning needs an assist with bad labels. Clearly you don't trust the merits of your arguments to persuade by themselves.
Thanks for sharing but no one claimed you had to find anything useful.
The contention was that these add-ons would alter buying decisions. That contention has been left unproven. Thanks for playing.
I'd say the lack of people ready to purchase them.
Again that is nice and plenty of people just plug in their car charge, wall charger or whatever. Again you claimed this as some sort of unique iPhone attribute when clearly it isn't.
There are plenty of advantages. You can buy an extended battery and not have to worry about those long calls with double the capacity. You can work the phone through several hours at work, arrive home and simply swap for a fresh battery when running out for the evening. You've got a fresh start with no concerns at that point.
Thanks for the personal attack Mr. Moderator.
Don't forget that there is a video capture side to that equation as well.
Of course they are trying to blunt the momentum of the iPhone. It's almost like they are the number one cell provider watching number two get by with one giant crutch and if they can kick it out from under them, it will cause number two large problems.
It's almost like they are competing or something strange like that....
They'll probably go to the Android App Store and download the apps just like iPhone users.
I'm not too worried about Dan and his 14 word attempt at thought. Everything goes through growing pains. On the iPhone Apple already has the GS with compass and voice command support, MMS and tethering, the 3G with only MMS and tethering support, but not the first two features, and both run different processors, etc. People sort it out just fine in the end.
Perhaps at one point it was an advantage but between bluetooth, wifi, and microUSB being available is there seriously anything you can prove it can do that those cannot? I understand it is a legacy connector and people have used it to plug into cars and so forth but that doesn't mean other items cannot be made to do that as well.
It can be done directly with microUSB as well. USB controls plenty of peripherals. The point is that no one would need to take the only option available and slap some ridiculous inelegant add-ons to it in an attempt to make something work. They could just make a differenet solution. If someone wants to make an Android phone with more incredible optics and a 12 MP camera but it ends up almost an inch thick, someone can. They don't have to take a half inch think iPhone and slap a whole second body onto it.
Marketing, brand awareness, there are two advantages right there.
Perhaps not to you, but the market is getting ready to offer netbooks and tablets with Android on it and 1 ghz snapdragon processors.
Why would an iPhone need a giant attachment in an attempt to make it a weak camcorder?
It doesn't really matter if you endorse it. You do a search on Safari on your iPhone and it goes to Google. You look at a YouTube video and that is Google. You add a gmail account and that is Google. You look up maps and also businesses, addresses and directions and that is Google. Your phone apps that have ads in the from Admob, that is now Google.
I think you fail to see that it is still Google's model, just being emulated by smaller and likely less capable sources.
Wrong. Apple is responsible for securing the iPhone. Secondary breaches are still the fault of Apple's inability to stop the primary breach.
An entire post full of nothing. Thanks for the long read.
Thanks for showing that the global moderator has nothing but dismissals and personal attacks to make his point.
You don't get what a personal attack is. It's not saying that a statement made is lame. It would be calling YOU lame, which I haven't done.
And none of your statements are anything but dismissals of what I've said. I honestly couldn't find a reason to address your lines individually, because you didn't say anything. I give information, and you say "no". How am I expected to answer that, say "yes"?
I give a reason why hardware is good for iPhone users, and you point out something that you think is stupid, which has nothing to do with the category, but merely that you don't like that one item.
I point out the importance of the 30 pin connector, which by the way, other manufacturers have been trying to force Apple to submit as a standard so they can all use it, and you say it doesn't matter.
There's no way to counter such remarks, because they have no basis in any fact, just a biased opinion of yours.
Your last post said nothing, just denials of the points I made.
You don't get what a personal attack is. It's not saying that a statement made is lame. It would be calling YOU lame, which I haven't done.
The original comment:
It's very funny that you would make such lame remarks.
See now if I wanted to be so obtuse about the intent of the posting guidelines, I could, for example say that it is very sad that you would take such terrible actions as a moderator.
By your reasoning, I've not violated the posting guidelines because I've only made comments about your actions, and not you personally. Attaching you and an action means you are describing the person.
So "You suck" for example would still be considered a comment on you, not really just describing an action you are taking.
So please now do us all a favor and stop mistreating people. Saying someone is lame or saying their typed phrase is lame isn't good reasoning in any form or fashion.
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And none of your statements are anything but dismissals of what I've said. I honestly couldn't find a reason to address your lines individually, because you didn't say anything. I give information, and you say "no". How am I expected to answer that, say "yes"?
I addressed them specifically and to be polite, you simply got upset about being proven wrong. You clearly didn't know that there are battery microUSB chargers and that they give any phone with a microUSB port the same capability you claimed was exclusive to the iPhone and thus an advantage rather than a disadvantage. Don't be a sore sport. I also linked to a $99 package to improve the iPhone video camera abilities and noted the very expensive GPS options. Those are not dismissals at all. They are actual products that address what was being discussed.
Apple only differentiates the iPhone with the amount of RAM and you claimed this differentiation could occur via the 30 pin port. I simply noted that multiple Android hardware manufacturers could differentiate with their actual hardware rather than attempts to tack on strange contraptions to the one solution Apple offers.
Ford was no different when selling only the Model T at one point and many car collectors can note the array of unique products that existed to deal with the shortcomings and desires to improve vehicle. Other companies that actually just introduced improved vehicles though didn't suffer from the lack of aftermarket products, they had the improvements already as part of the product.
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I give a reason why hardware is good for iPhone users, and you point out something that you think is stupid, which has nothing to do with the category, but merely that you don't like that one item.
I point out that since multiple parties are making Android phones that if someone wants to make a one inch thick phone with a 12 MP sensor and 10X optical zoom and someone else wants to make a half inch thick phone with a 5MP sensor and a fixed lens, both will be available and the consumer can choose. The Apple consumer will have to buy the one available iPhone model and a $99 camera add on that is much larger and cumbersome. They still have that choice of course but I wouldn't call it an advantage that will alter buying decisions which is what you claimed. You claimed people would be buying iPhones instead of Android devices because they had plug in external batteries and external (cumbersome) devices that can be controlled via the 30 pin connector. That was your claim which is still unsupported.
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I point out the importance of the 30 pin connector, which by the way, other manufacturers have been trying to force Apple to submit as a standard so they can all use it, and you say it doesn't matter.
I didn't say it doesn't matter. I said it is legacy and much of the functionality is being replaced by newer and better interfaces. Do you worry as much about a 30 pin connector when you have stereo bluetooth available and also the ability to control devices with bluetooth? No you don't. Could all the steering wheel functionality of controlling an iPod and having music from it go through the vehicle stereo system be duplicated now with bluetooth? Of course it could.
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There's no way to counter such remarks, because they have no basis in any fact, just a biased opinion of yours.
It is a fact that microUSB, bluetooth and WIFI together can duplicate any functionality available via the 30 pin connector.
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Your last post said nothing, just denials of the points I made.
You keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better.
It is a fact that microUSB, bluetooth and WIFI together can duplicate any functionality available via the 30 pin connector.
(Stewie voice) You see a lot of Motorola Droid car attachments, do ya? Come across a lot Docks for alarm clocks and home speakers and such for the Motorola Droid, eh? Reading NYTimes articles about Motorola Droid ecosystems, are we? Have entire aisles at your local electronic stores dedicated to adding to your Motorola Droid, hmm? Okay, okay? sure you do.
(Stewie voice) You see a lot of Motorola Droid car attachments, do ya? Come across a lot Docks for alarm clocks and home speakers and such for the Motorola Droid, eh? Reading NYTimes articles about Motorola Droid ecosystems, are we? Have entire aisles at your local electronic stores dedicated to adding to your Motorola Droid, hmm? Okay, okay? sure you do.
I don't see those for my Mac either compared to PC's yet I still love it to death.
It is interesting to see the arguments so reversed. Every Mac user knows that there are enough options available for that our platform to keep it enjoyable and usable. I don't need 500 first person shooters, I can be content with 50 of them.
The same is true with my iPhone and also any competitor to the iPhone that I would investigate. There only needs to be a critical mass of applications, accessories and what have you. Above that might be nice, but certainly not necessary.
Tell you what Sol, suggest some solutions to create an even deeper satisfaction with my iPhone. I very much like the bar that Android has where with a push of a button you can turn on and off items like wifi, bluetooth, locations services, etc. All in one handy widget.
Please find it for me so we can put another nail in the Android coffin.
You don't get what a personal attack is. It's not saying that a statement made is lame. It would be calling YOU lame, which I haven't done.
Just gotta go off on a tangent here. I agree with your description what of a personal attack is. Strange that I once had an infraction for exactly that. I clearly said another posters comments were such-and-such and got an infraction for it. When I asked for an explanation, lundy explicitly listed the adjectives I used to describe the posters comments as examples of ad homs. (I also said the poster was sad, which was also said to be an ad hom)
Puzzling. More puzzling was he then implied that my asking for the clarification was 'weird'.
So, sometimes, I guess criticizing a comment is considered a personal attack.
It's very funny that you would make such lame remarks.
See now if I wanted to be so obtuse about the intent of the posting guidelines, I could, for example say that it is very sad that you would take such terrible actions as a moderator.
By your reasoning, I've not violated the posting guidelines because I've only made comments about your actions, and not you personally. Attaching you and an action means you are describing the person.
So "You suck" for example would still be considered a comment on you, not really just describing an action you are taking.
So please now do us all a favor and stop mistreating people. Saying someone is lame or saying their typed phrase is lame isn't good reasoning in any form or fashion.
First, I will tell you that I never said that you violated anything. Secondly, if I said that you were lame, that would have been wrong. But despite what you are saying, there's nothing wrong in saying that your statements are lame. If you are offended so easily, I'm sorry you feel that way, but it's not an insult.
If you insist in misinterpreting things, it's not my fault.
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I addressed them specifically and to be polite, you simply got upset about being proven wrong. You clearly didn't know that there are battery microUSB chargers and that they give any phone with a microUSB port the same capability you claimed was exclusive to the iPhone and thus an advantage rather than a disadvantage. Don't be a sore sport. I also linked to a $99 package to improve the iPhone video camera abilities and noted the very expensive GPS options. Those are not dismissals at all. They are actual products that address what was being discussed.
You really didn't. You dismissed an entire category of product because you dislike one item, or the cost of another. That's not a valid argument. We can dismiss any product category because we don't like one item. That doesn't make it a valid opinion.
I never said that micro chargers were the exclusive provence of the iPhone. YOU re saying I did.
What you said was that with a changeable battery, you would change it before a phone call, and so that made it better than the built-in battery of the iPhone. I pointed out that we could buy portable batteries to plug the iPhone into and could use the phone as we were doing so, which you couldn't do with a removable battery.
That was simply in response to your simple statement about having the advantage of a replaceable battery. I never said that there weren't portable batteries for other devices. I knew that there were, but you weren't taking about them. You were extolling the advantage of the changeable one to the disparagement of the iPhone. An advantage that doesn't exist..
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Apple only differentiates the iPhone with the amount of RAM and you claimed this differentiation could occur via the 30 pin port. I simply noted that multiple Android hardware manufacturers could differentiate with their actual hardware rather than attempts to tack on strange contraptions to the one solution Apple offers.
There are two different concepts here. I have no problems with either existing.
But my argument with the way Android will be managed is that they will move apart over time, and so we won't be talking about Android devices so much as devices from different manufacturers. I stand by that. You can disagree if you want.
But we won't see what you're talking about with Android. Why would someone come out with a phone chemical sensor, as we see with that new device from NASA? They won't. It's not going to happen. And so Android serves no purpose in a device such as that when any Linux distro will do as well.
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Ford was no different when selling only the Model T at one point and many car collectors can note the array of unique products that existed to deal with the shortcomings and desires to improve vehicle. Other companies that actually just introduced improved vehicles though didn't suffer from the lack of aftermarket products, they had the improvements already as part of the product.
We'll see. Apple does immensely well with it's iPod lines where they sell tens of millions of the same devices every year.
A phone is not a car. One might want to buy a $25,000 car every so often these days, but many people buy a new phone every year, two the most.
So far, there's no evidence that people are tired of Apple's basic phone design. Sales are still growing very quickly.
I really don't know exactly what you are thinking in terms of these Android devices as far as hardware goes. Give us some idea, other than a phone/computer. Exactly what device that's coming out for the iPhone would you see as an actual Android product?
You're saying that unlike the iPhone, which tens of millions will be buying each year, with some number of people buying hardware that will suit some need of theirs that can be attached and detached as needed, and left at home or work, you say that people will instead want to but many entire devices instead? Why would they do that?
You're going to have to explain this in some detail with some examples.
We ARE talking about phone/computing devices here remember. If what you're talking about doesn't include that as part of the product, it doesn't count.
I have gas sensing equipment now. I would be interested in buying an accessory that would allow my phone computer to do that, but not an entire phone with one built in.
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I point out that since multiple parties are making Android phones that if someone wants to make a one inch thick phone with a 12 MP sensor and 10X optical zoom and someone else wants to make a half inch thick phone with a 5MP sensor and a fixed lens, both will be available and the consumer can choose. The Apple consumer will have to buy the one available iPhone model and a $99 camera add on that is much larger and cumbersome. They still have that choice of course but I wouldn't call it an advantage that will alter buying decisions which is what you claimed. You claimed people would be buying iPhones instead of Android devices because they had plug in external batteries and external (cumbersome) devices that can be controlled via the 30 pin connector. That was your claim which is still unsupported.
I can understand the concept of buying different phones by different people. But that's why Apple has such a large ecology of docking stations, from simple ones to go to your audio/video system, to entire systems. That's because all phones can fit. The problem with the many sizes scheme is, is that it makes it impossible for any one manufacturer, or esp any one phone to sell enough for a manufacturer to have an interest in making such devices.
And the fact that there as SO many shows that they are popular, and making money for their companies.
And yes, these things do have people wanting an iPhone (and iPods) so that they can buy the devices as well.
You're not going to see much of this for any other phones.
It's funny that you should think that the five seconds it takes to plug your phone into a dock is clumsy. Tell the millions of people who are buying these dockable devices that.
My "claim" isn't unsupported. You just aren't interested in acknowledging the many millions of devices sold for this purpose, and how it enhances the iPhone ownership experience.
And, by the way, you seem to be making the assumption that I think that every phone buyer in the world will be buying an iPhone. I don't think that. There will be people, likely a majority of them that will be buying other phones, possibly some form of Android phone.
All i'm saying is that Apple will continue to have a very successful product with very good sales.
If someone wants a phone with a 10 MP camera sensor, then fine, let them buy that instead.
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I didn't say it doesn't matter. I said it is legacy and much of the functionality is being replaced by newer and better interfaces. Do you worry as much about a 30 pin connector when you have stereo bluetooth available and also the ability to control devices with bluetooth? No you don't. Could all the steering wheel functionality of controlling an iPod and having music from it go through the vehicle stereo system be duplicated now with bluetooth? Of course it could.
You may think it's legacy, but the new devices coming out all the time prove its not.
Neither USB or Bluetooth are in any way close to the usefulness of the connector Apple has. Neither allows the complete control over the phone by the device, or complete control of the device by the the phone.
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It is a fact that microUSB, bluetooth and WIFI together can duplicate any functionality available via the 30 pin connector.
Not even close. None control anything.
Why don't you give some links to prove those contentions. Show how those communication protocols can control the device the way software and Apple's 30 pin connector can. If you can't then leave it alone.
We already have the evidence of what Apple can do. It's your turn.
Just gotta go off on a tangent here. I agree with your description what of a personal attack is. Strange that I once had an infraction for exactly that. I clearly said another posters comments were such-and-such and got an infraction for it. When I asked for an explanation, lundy explicitly listed the adjectives I used to describe the posters comments as examples of ad homs. (I also said the poster was sad, which was also said to be an ad hom)
Puzzling. More puzzling was he then implied that my asking for the clarification was 'weird'.
So, sometimes, I guess criticizing a comment is considered a personal attack.
I've never yet given anyone an infraction. I've asked them to not say things. I've edited posts, and removed a few. I rather PM people.
But we've ALL done stupid things. If someone says that was stupid, my response, would be, yeah, it was, I better be more careful. I know the person, as long as they don't have some vendetta, isn't calling me stupid.
I think the confusion here is that Trumptman has ventured forth from his customary Lundy run AO swill world and expects to do his usual goading people into saying something to get them banned.
Lundy bans people for saying something is factually untrue or makes no sense, and generally applies a level of moderation unlike anything else on AI-- something that the site seems to be in denial about, for some reason. Maybe the mods just kinda hate AO, in which case they should shut it down.
Your screen name is very suitable. Apparently, even you realize your limitations.
But then you show them in your posting as well. Very clever!
The only thing there that the iPhone doesn't do for third party apps is multitasking, which right now is limited to Apple's own apps, or a few third party ones such as Google Maps.
The rest are there, you just don't seem to know it.
Personal attacks (involving these about nickname, which you know nothing about the origin) shows that you are out of arguments, which is perfectly in-line with what you wrote : rubbish.
So congratulations to you : YOU WON. I am no longer trying to refute your apparent lies and FUDs.
Trying to put reasonable arguments only to see you either ignore them or post a nonsense as reply or personal attack, like in the last case, or combination of all of this, make me feel like talking to the brick wall. So enjoy your time there, global moderator, I am off.
Personal attacks (involving these about nickname, which you know nothing about the origin) shows that you are out of arguments, which is perfectly in-line with what you wrote : rubbish.
So congratulations to you : YOU WON. I am no longer trying to refute your apparent lies and FUDs.
Trying to put reasonable arguments only to see you either ignore them or post a nonsense as reply or personal attack, like in the last case, or combination of all of this, make me feel like talking to the brick wall. So enjoy your time there, global moderator, I am off.
I think we should leave this for now, until either Motorola or Verizon decide to say something, or other more reliable numbers come out, as we're not going to settle this.
Basically like I've been saying, in between the 100,000 "Verizon store thumb guess" and 400,000 "what about the addition of sales from other resellers?" marks. Considering that the Droid only sold in the US on Verizon (as opposed to the 8 countries the 3GS sold in), I'd say that's really impressive.
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As a moderator of these forums, you really should be above personal attacks.
I'll agree that there are some products coming out like this one from OWLE that are currently unique to the iPhone. However, especially as a long time Mac users, many of these products simply attempt to overcome the one size fits all nature of Apple solutions. Either that or they help someone already rationalize a purchase. I can't imagine anyone passing up their first choice of phone though due to the ability to buy a $99 kit to make their phone attempt to match an inexpensive camcorder. The iPhone has plenty of attachable battery packs that no other phone has as well. That is to overcome the Apple refusal to make a replaceable battery. It isn't an advantage but more like an attempt to address a limitation.
They are lame remarks. I'm not attacking you, just what you said, which is perfectly fine.
That's a unique product, and will likely find some use.
It's interesting that we now have had two major motion pictures made with purely amateur equipment that made hundreds of millions of dollars. The last one, I forget the name, just cost $15,000 to make. So this might find some use.
Yo are picking what you think are, to you, the worst choices. but the fact that there are many choices is what's important. Attempting to find fault with a few jut makes your case weaker.
All phones with removable batteries are no better than the iPhone with a non removable one.
I can use a battery pack to add to my phone while I'm still in the process of using it. In the middle of a call, for instance.
What phone do you have with a removable battery pack that allows you to do that?
And these battery packs, most of which offer more than the juice of the built in pack, cost no more than, or no more than a few dollars more than a replaceable battery pack from other manufacturers.
Advantage iPhone.
The iPhone has its 3.2Mp camera as an example. Apple may improve it next year or they may not. I'm leaning towards not since it was upgraded last year. Droid already has 5 MP and several other Android phone manufacturers are already aiming much higher than that. That will be the flexibility of that platform. If someone wants to produce a phone that is thicker with better MP and optics, someone can choose that and if someone wants no keyboard and 5 MP camera for $99, someone can produce that as well. It isn't one size fits all like Apple. I'm not claiming that hurts Apple, just noting that many of the products attempting to deal with that one size solution are not an advantage to Apple or a disadvantage to others.
And interestingly enough, so far, none of the phone cameras with 5 MP sensors have been reviewed to have better pictures than the one in the #GS. Even as far as resolution goes, most seem to be no better.
5MP is a joke so far for these tiny sensors. The flashes are also marginally useful. Once you move more that three feet away, they do nothing.
What really is interesting is why focus on the Droid alone or the Droid at all? Android is the platform that Apple has to worry about. It would be like noting Apple is okay because Asus only sold X number of PC's while ignoring Dell, HP, and others. I noted that I need three things to make the jump. Management software of some sort, an Audible.com client and perhaps I haven't investigated it enough but I want to use Yahoo in the native mail client. The Sense UI looks great and the $99 Droid Eris on Verizon is actually much more tempting to me right now than the Moto Droid. When it has 2.0 on it as well, it will be very hard to turn down.
The Droid is being pictured as the new iPhone killer. The new Jesus phone. just look at Verizon's commercials. They're the ones doing it, and its their phone here.
I don't think Apple has to worry about it. android isn't going to take over the market, just a minority of it, like Apple.
They will both be successful. But Android may break into several only vaguely compatible fiefs in a few years. Then we won't be talking about Android any more than we talk about Linux phones, which is what it's based upon. We'll be talking about Motorola phones, Verizon phones, HTC phones, etc.
His point is valid. No one would claim that the MP3 app wouldn't work because the data has to be on the card. The phone can access unlimited data. The app limitation is being addressed and appears to be part of concerns about initiallys securing the phone. Apple has no clean bill of health here with iPhones being rickrolled and having notifications pop up begging for cash to secure them. Every platform has growing pains.
You can't get the data out of the app, and move it anywhere. He's wrong.
Not a single iPhone that wasn't jailbroken was Rickrolled. In fact, it MUST be jailbroken. In addition, you must be using SSH software, and too lazy to have changed the default passwords. Something that even routers come with.
So if you have a router or modem with the default user name as "admin", and the password as "user", you are pretty dumb if you don't immediately change it to something strong, or it will quickly be broken into. No difference.
As I've said, that "number of 100,000 estimates" you point to still all originate from Mark McKechnie at Broadpoint AmTech, Inc. The articles may be differently worded from each other, but the data still comes from a single point of origin. That's a fact. It's right in the second paragraph of the Bloomberg article you linked to.
My point wasn't to argue over the success of Droid (if that's how you want to take it, the so be it), just that Michael Cote made a very valid point and I am pretty much asking the same question he is. Does the 100,000 number take into account other ways of purchasing the Droid?
The only assumption I've made is that Best Buy and the other resellers have an independent line of stock than Verizon itself, thus allowing for more than 200,000 total Droid in stock. Which is just as fair as the assumption you're using that there were only 200,000 Droid period.
I think we should leave this for now, until either Motorola or Verizon decide to say something, or other more reliable numbers come out, as we're not going to settle this.
No, he doesn?t. When you your app has to quite small due to size limitations ands supporting fiels stored separately, it?s not only inconvenient, it?s unnatural for the average user. This will not make normal consumers happy if they have to install more files after the app install or if they remove the micro-SD card not realizing that the app is not stored internally. Smartphones geared toward geeks aren?t a real world focus. For Android to work for the average person you?ll see internal storage increase.
The average consumer with this phone is going to download the app from an online store and has no idea where the files are stored. The average consumer likely won't even touch the micro-SD card.
PS: Apple?s bill of health with the iPhone is good. The iPhone security issue is from jailbroken devices with OpenSSH installed and the root password not changed. Without these three things entry is not had. Same goes for any PC with any OS. Why is this simple fact so hard?
It isn't hard and Apple is still responsible because people who are not fanboyz don't excuse the breach due to jailbreaking when Apple is the one responsible for the security breaches that allow jailbreaking in the first place.
They are lame remarks. I'm not attacking you, just what you said, which is perfectly fine.
I know your age and that said, grow up.
That's a unique product, and will likely find some use.
A can opener bungee corded to a razor could find some use. It doesn't make it a viable product that will alter market outcomes. That was your contention so stop moving the goal posts.
It's interesting that we now have had two major motion pictures made with purely amateur equipment that made hundreds of millions of dollars. The last one, I forget the name, just cost $15,000 to make. So this might find some use.
Some use.... you were claiming it would alter buying decisions.
Yo are picking what you think are, to you, the worst choices. but the fact that there are many choices is what's important. Attempting to find fault with a few jut makes your case weaker.
What the hell are you talking about with many choices? Folks are still clamoring for their bluetooth gamepads, bluetooth keyboards, apple socket connectors for... you name it. Little has been done in this area. I'm not taking the worst of many examples. I'm taking the few examples available.
All phones with removable batteries are no better than the iPhone with a non removable one.
I can use a battery pack to add to my phone while I'm still in the process of using it. In the middle of a call, for instance.
What phone do you have with a removable battery pack that allows you to do that?
And these battery packs, most of which offer more than the juice of the built in pack, cost no more than, or no more than a few dollars more than a replaceable battery pack from other manufacturers.
Advantage iPhone.
Your example is hilarious. All the other phones simply change the battery out before the call or after the call. There would be no need to sweat it in the middle of the call because they can REMOVE THE BATTERY. This is exactly what I noted before. You take a disadvantage and make it sound like an advantage.
Also my phones have all kept calls when being plugged into a charger. Thus any microUSB charger would accomplish the same thing just like this one here. So in answer to your question of what other phones could accomplish the same task, my answer would be every phone I have owned because all have allowed talking while being plugged into a charging source and since the source can also be a battery back just like the link I posted, the answer is all of them.
Advantage: People with a clue who don't have to resort to name calling to make a point.
And interestingly enough, so far, none of the phone cameras with 5 MP sensors have been reviewed to have better pictures than the one in the #GS. Even as far as resolution goes, most seem to be no better.
5MP is a joke so far for these tiny sensors. The flashes are also marginally useful. Once you move more that three feet away, they do nothing.
I've read several reviews where it was claimed to match the iPhone and also several where it was claimed to be better.
The Droid is being pictured as the new iPhone killer. The new Jesus phone. just look at Verizon's commercials. They're the ones doing it, and its their phone here.
Clearly Verizon wants to show that they have a good selection of smartphones to dissuade people from pondering a move to AT&T. Their advertising supports the Droid but also knocks the network.
I don't think Apple has to worry about it. android isn't going to take over the market, just a minority of it, like Apple.
They will both be successful. But Android may break into several only vaguely compatible fiefs in a few years. Then we won't be talking about Android any more than we talk about Linux phones, which is what it's based upon. We'll be talking about Motorola phones, Verizon phones, HTC phones, etc.
Vaguely compatible? How will Apple not have the same problem while improving their platform? How is something going to be compatible with the original iPhone and whatever Apple has available in two years which will hopefully have double the screen resolution, 400% more powerful processor than the original and so forth?
One thing that will be most interesting is what you noted with vertical integration. Since you are allowed to install Android on so many more phone forms, people really could make a great camcorder and use it to run the phone add on or whatever. You really design a pro-audio device and run Android on it. That is one of the big advantages that Google is pressing and Apple should be addressing.
You can't get the data out of the app, and move it anywhere. He's wrong.
Data in no form has to be within the app. Even thinking so is endorsing the iPhone model instead of addressing the Google cloud model. In that model the app would be small and would just go get all the recipes and whatever is necessary over the network.
Not a single iPhone that wasn't jailbroken was Rickrolled. In fact, it MUST be jailbroken. In addition, you must be using SSH software, and too lazy to have changed the default passwords. Something that even routers come with.
So if you have a router or modem with the default user name as "admin", and the password as "user", you are pretty dumb if you don't immediately change it to something strong, or it will quickly be broken into. No difference.
Who's fault is it the iPhone can be jailbroken?
...Apple is still responsible because people who are not fanboyz don't excuse the breach due to jailbreaking when Apple is the one responsible for the security breaches that allow jailbreaking in the first place.
No, they are not. No system is hack proof when you have the HW and OS in front of you. If you have taken the time to jailbreak your phone at the risk of voiding the warranty then you are responsible for any hacking, spyware or viruses it receives because of such action. Apple is responsible if their App Store leads to any of these as they are the ones control and okaying that method of entry.
By your argument people who due from using a hairdryer in the bath can hold the company responsible regardless of any warnings on the label because using a device outside of the intended use is the company?s fault, not the user?s.
I know your age and that said, grow up.
When you stop making lame comments, it will be time to stop mentioning it.
A can opener bungee corded to a razor could find some use. It doesn't make it a viable product that will alter market outcomes. That was your contention so stop moving the goal posts.
There are plenty of products that many people don't find useful, and that many others do. Whether you or I find a product to be useless to us isn't important.
Some use.... you were claiming it would alter buying decisions.
For those who find the product useful, it will.
What the hell are you talking about with many choices? Folks are still clamoring for their bluetooth gamepads, bluetooth keyboards, apple socket connectors for... you name it. Little has been done in this area. I'm not taking the worst of many examples. I'm taking the few examples available.
Those will come too. I've seen some prototypes. I don't know what the delay on individual products is.
Your example is hilarious. All the other phones simply change the battery out before the call or after the call. There would be no need to sweat it in the middle of the call because they can REMOVE THE BATTERY. This is exactly what I noted before. You take a disadvantage and make it sound like an advantage.
It's funny to you because you want to stick to your statement. I've been on long calls where my plug in battery was very useful. There are times where you can't change out the battery before making a call. Or don't realize the call will go on for so long.
Also my phones have all kept calls when being plugged into a charger. Thus any microUSB charger would accomplish the same thing just like this one here. So in answer to your question of what other phones could accomplish the same task, my answer would be every phone I have owned because all have allowed talking while being plugged into a charging source and since the source can also be a battery back just like the link I posted, the answer is all of them.
So what is your point then? You were the one talking about the advantages of changing the battery! With that, or any of the other models out, your phone still has no advantage. But there are specialized models just for the iPhone that are much better than that.
Advantage: People with a clue who don't have to resort to name calling to make a point.
Yes, and when you get a clue, let us know.
I've read several reviews where it was claimed to match the iPhone and also several where it was claimed to be better.
Most have said it was about the same, or worse.
Clearly Verizon wants to show that they have a good selection of smartphones to dissuade people from pondering a move to AT&T. Their advertising supports the Droid but also knocks the network.
Of course. But don't say it's just iPhone fans trying to set the Droid up as a potential iPhone killer. Its clearly Verizon that's trying that.
Vaguely compatible? How will Apple not have the same problem while improving their platform? How is something going to be compatible with the original iPhone and whatever Apple has available in two years which will hopefully have double the screen resolution, 400% more powerful processor than the original and so forth?
Because, as I've now said numerous times, Apple's phones come out in succession. All the differing Android phones will be coming out at the same time. That's much more confusing. How are software developers going to let people know which phones are compatible or not? There will be too many of them.
http://www.businessinsider.com/googl...fusing-2009-11
There's another that discussed the branching off of Android as various companies start making them, but I can't find it now.
One thing that will be most interesting is what you noted with vertical integration. Since you are allowed to install Android on so many more phone forms, people really could make a great camcorder and use it to run the phone add on or whatever. You really design a pro-audio device and run Android on it. That is one of the big advantages that Google is pressing and Apple should be addressing.
A major advantage Apple has is their 30 pin connector that allows close integration with the hardware. No other phone or player has anything like this. It's why we will see hardware add ons for Apple's devices that we won't see anywhere else.
We don't need a special device to run the iPhone OS for a camcorder, because it can be done directly.
Otherwise, I see no advantage using Android as an embedded OS. There are already plenty of Linux based embedded OS's for that purpose, and Android adds little to that space. Embedded OS's are feature limited to what that specialized device needs.
It's one thing having a phone that can be adapted for limited use for other functions, and it's become a computer to power these other bits. But to make a bit with the OS doesn't make sense.
Why would a camcorder need Android? What would Android do for it that a more specialized Linux distro couldn't, remembering that Android IS a Linux distro?
Data in no form has to be within the app. Even thinking so is endorsing the iPhone model instead of addressing the Google cloud model. In that model the app would be small and would just go get all the recipes and whatever is necessary over the network.
I'm not sure why we HAVE to endorse the Google cloud model. I see an advantage for it in the future if they can fix the reliability and security problems. And if they will promise to never use your information for anything else, which they will not do, because that's the entire purpose for Google having it in their servers in the first place.
Meanwhile, all my apps that need to can access information over the net. We don't need Google's model to do that.
Who's fault is it the iPhone can be jailbroken?
What does that have to do with people screwing themselves up by doing it? That's their fault, not Apple's.
No, they are not. No system is hack proof when you have the HW and OS in front of you. If you have taken the time to jailbreak your phone at the risk of voiding the warranty then you are responsible for any hacking, spyware or viruses it receives because of such action. Apple is responsible if their App Store leads to any of these as they are the ones control and okaying that method of entry.
By your argument people who due from using a hairdryer in the bath can hold the company responsible regardless of any warnings on the label because using a device outside of the intended use is the company?s fault, not the user?s.
Bad analogies don't fix bad reasoning. The iPhone is not secure in the first place. The fact that some uses that lack of security to render it even less secure doesnt excuse the initial security breach.
When you stop making lame comments, it will be time to stop mentioning it.
Oh gee, I'm rubber and you are glue, it bounces off of me and back onto you. Don't worry, bad reasoning needs an assist with bad labels. Clearly you don't trust the merits of your arguments to persuade by themselves.
There are plenty of products that many people don't find useful, and that many others do. Whether you or I find a product to be useless to us isn't important.
Thanks for sharing but no one claimed you had to find anything useful.
For those who find the product useful, it will.
The contention was that these add-ons would alter buying decisions. That contention has been left unproven. Thanks for playing.
Those will come too. I've seen some prototypes. I don't know what the delay on individual products is.
I'd say the lack of people ready to purchase them.
It's funny to you because you want to stick to your statement. I've been on long calls where my plug in battery was very useful. There are times where you can't change out the battery before making a call. Or don't realize the call will go on for so long.
Again that is nice and plenty of people just plug in their car charge, wall charger or whatever. Again you claimed this as some sort of unique iPhone attribute when clearly it isn't.
So what is your point then? You were the one talking about the advantages of changing the battery! With that, or any of the other models out, your phone still has no advantage. But there are specialized models just for the iPhone that are much better than that.
There are plenty of advantages. You can buy an extended battery and not have to worry about those long calls with double the capacity. You can work the phone through several hours at work, arrive home and simply swap for a fresh battery when running out for the evening. You've got a fresh start with no concerns at that point.
Yes, and when you get a clue, let us know.
Thanks for the personal attack Mr. Moderator.
Most have said it was about the same, or worse.
Don't forget that there is a video capture side to that equation as well.
Of course. But don't say it's just iPhone fans trying to set the Droid up as a potential iPhone killer. Its clearly Verizon that's trying that.
Of course they are trying to blunt the momentum of the iPhone. It's almost like they are the number one cell provider watching number two get by with one giant crutch and if they can kick it out from under them, it will cause number two large problems.
It's almost like they are competing or something strange like that....
Because, as I've now said numerous times, Apple's phones come out in succession. All the differing Android phones will be coming out at the same time. That's much more confusing. How are software developers going to let people know which phones are compatible or not? There will be too many of them.
They'll probably go to the Android App Store and download the apps just like iPhone users.
http://www.businessinsider.com/googl...fusing-2009-11
There's another that discussed the branching off of Android as various companies start making them, but I can't find it now.
I'm not too worried about Dan and his 14 word attempt at thought. Everything goes through growing pains. On the iPhone Apple already has the GS with compass and voice command support, MMS and tethering, the 3G with only MMS and tethering support, but not the first two features, and both run different processors, etc. People sort it out just fine in the end.
A major advantage Apple has is their 30 pin connector that allows close integration with the hardware. No other phone or player has anything like this. It's why we will see hardware add ons for Apple's devices that we won't see anywhere else.
Perhaps at one point it was an advantage but between bluetooth, wifi, and microUSB being available is there seriously anything you can prove it can do that those cannot? I understand it is a legacy connector and people have used it to plug into cars and so forth but that doesn't mean other items cannot be made to do that as well.
We don't need a special device to run the iPhone OS for a camcorder, because it can be done directly.
It can be done directly with microUSB as well. USB controls plenty of peripherals. The point is that no one would need to take the only option available and slap some ridiculous inelegant add-ons to it in an attempt to make something work. They could just make a differenet solution. If someone wants to make an Android phone with more incredible optics and a 12 MP camera but it ends up almost an inch thick, someone can. They don't have to take a half inch think iPhone and slap a whole second body onto it.
Otherwise, I see no advantage using Android as an embedded OS. There are already plenty of Linux based embedded OS's for that purpose, and Android adds little to that space. Embedded OS's are feature limited to what that specialized device needs.
Marketing, brand awareness, there are two advantages right there.
It's one thing having a phone that can be adapted for limited use for other functions, and it's become a computer to power these other bits. But to make a bit with the OS doesn't make sense.
Perhaps not to you, but the market is getting ready to offer netbooks and tablets with Android on it and 1 ghz snapdragon processors.
Why would a camcorder need Android? What would Android do for it that a more specialized Linux distro couldn't, remembering that Android IS a Linux distro?
Why would an iPhone need a giant attachment in an attempt to make it a weak camcorder?
I'm not sure why we HAVE to endorse the Google cloud model. I see an advantage for it in the future if they can fix the reliability and security problems. And if they will promise to never use your information for anything else, which they will not do, because that's the entire purpose for Google having it in their servers in the first place.
It doesn't really matter if you endorse it. You do a search on Safari on your iPhone and it goes to Google. You look at a YouTube video and that is Google. You add a gmail account and that is Google. You look up maps and also businesses, addresses and directions and that is Google. Your phone apps that have ads in the from Admob, that is now Google.
Meanwhile, all my apps that need to can access information over the net. We don't need Google's model to do that.
I think you fail to see that it is still Google's model, just being emulated by smaller and likely less capable sources.
What does that have to do with people screwing themselves up by doing it? That's their fault, not Apple's.
Wrong. Apple is responsible for securing the iPhone. Secondary breaches are still the fault of Apple's inability to stop the primary breach.
Bad analogies don't fix bad reasoning. The iPhone is not secure in the first place. The fact that some uses that lack of security to render it even less secure doesnt excuse the initial security breach.
Oh gee, I'm rubber and you are glue, it bounces off of me and back onto you. Don't worry, bad reasoning needs an assist with bad labels. Clearly you don't trust the merits of your arguments to persuade by themselves.
Thanks for sharing but no one claimed you had to find anything useful.
The contention was that these add-ons would alter buying decisions. That contention has been left unproven. Thanks for playing.
I'd say the lack of people ready to purchase them.
Again that is nice and plenty of people just plug in their car charge, wall charger or whatever. Again you claimed this as some sort of unique iPhone attribute when clearly it isn't.
There are plenty of advantages. You can buy an extended battery and not have to worry about those long calls with double the capacity. You can work the phone through several hours at work, arrive home and simply swap for a fresh battery when running out for the evening. You've got a fresh start with no concerns at that point.
Thanks for the personal attack Mr. Moderator.
Don't forget that there is a video capture side to that equation as well.
Of course they are trying to blunt the momentum of the iPhone. It's almost like they are the number one cell provider watching number two get by with one giant crutch and if they can kick it out from under them, it will cause number two large problems.
It's almost like they are competing or something strange like that....
They'll probably go to the Android App Store and download the apps just like iPhone users.
I'm not too worried about Dan and his 14 word attempt at thought. Everything goes through growing pains. On the iPhone Apple already has the GS with compass and voice command support, MMS and tethering, the 3G with only MMS and tethering support, but not the first two features, and both run different processors, etc. People sort it out just fine in the end.
Perhaps at one point it was an advantage but between bluetooth, wifi, and microUSB being available is there seriously anything you can prove it can do that those cannot? I understand it is a legacy connector and people have used it to plug into cars and so forth but that doesn't mean other items cannot be made to do that as well.
It can be done directly with microUSB as well. USB controls plenty of peripherals. The point is that no one would need to take the only option available and slap some ridiculous inelegant add-ons to it in an attempt to make something work. They could just make a differenet solution. If someone wants to make an Android phone with more incredible optics and a 12 MP camera but it ends up almost an inch thick, someone can. They don't have to take a half inch think iPhone and slap a whole second body onto it.
Marketing, brand awareness, there are two advantages right there.
Perhaps not to you, but the market is getting ready to offer netbooks and tablets with Android on it and 1 ghz snapdragon processors.
Why would an iPhone need a giant attachment in an attempt to make it a weak camcorder?
It doesn't really matter if you endorse it. You do a search on Safari on your iPhone and it goes to Google. You look at a YouTube video and that is Google. You add a gmail account and that is Google. You look up maps and also businesses, addresses and directions and that is Google. Your phone apps that have ads in the from Admob, that is now Google.
I think you fail to see that it is still Google's model, just being emulated by smaller and likely less capable sources.
Wrong. Apple is responsible for securing the iPhone. Secondary breaches are still the fault of Apple's inability to stop the primary breach.
An entire post full of nothing. Thanks for the long read.
An entire post full of nothing. Thanks for the long read.
Thanks for showing that the global moderator has nothing but dismissals and personal attacks to make his point.
Thanks for showing that the global moderator has nothing but dismissals and personal attacks to make his point.
You don't get what a personal attack is. It's not saying that a statement made is lame. It would be calling YOU lame, which I haven't done.
And none of your statements are anything but dismissals of what I've said. I honestly couldn't find a reason to address your lines individually, because you didn't say anything. I give information, and you say "no". How am I expected to answer that, say "yes"?
I give a reason why hardware is good for iPhone users, and you point out something that you think is stupid, which has nothing to do with the category, but merely that you don't like that one item.
I point out the importance of the 30 pin connector, which by the way, other manufacturers have been trying to force Apple to submit as a standard so they can all use it, and you say it doesn't matter.
There's no way to counter such remarks, because they have no basis in any fact, just a biased opinion of yours.
Your last post said nothing, just denials of the points I made.
You don't get what a personal attack is. It's not saying that a statement made is lame. It would be calling YOU lame, which I haven't done.
The original comment:
It's very funny that you would make such lame remarks.
See now if I wanted to be so obtuse about the intent of the posting guidelines, I could, for example say that it is very sad that you would take such terrible actions as a moderator.
By your reasoning, I've not violated the posting guidelines because I've only made comments about your actions, and not you personally. Attaching you and an action means you are describing the person.
So "You suck" for example would still be considered a comment on you, not really just describing an action you are taking.
So please now do us all a favor and stop mistreating people. Saying someone is lame or saying their typed phrase is lame isn't good reasoning in any form or fashion.
And none of your statements are anything but dismissals of what I've said. I honestly couldn't find a reason to address your lines individually, because you didn't say anything. I give information, and you say "no". How am I expected to answer that, say "yes"?
I addressed them specifically and to be polite, you simply got upset about being proven wrong. You clearly didn't know that there are battery microUSB chargers and that they give any phone with a microUSB port the same capability you claimed was exclusive to the iPhone and thus an advantage rather than a disadvantage. Don't be a sore sport. I also linked to a $99 package to improve the iPhone video camera abilities and noted the very expensive GPS options. Those are not dismissals at all. They are actual products that address what was being discussed.
Apple only differentiates the iPhone with the amount of RAM and you claimed this differentiation could occur via the 30 pin port. I simply noted that multiple Android hardware manufacturers could differentiate with their actual hardware rather than attempts to tack on strange contraptions to the one solution Apple offers.
Ford was no different when selling only the Model T at one point and many car collectors can note the array of unique products that existed to deal with the shortcomings and desires to improve vehicle. Other companies that actually just introduced improved vehicles though didn't suffer from the lack of aftermarket products, they had the improvements already as part of the product.
I give a reason why hardware is good for iPhone users, and you point out something that you think is stupid, which has nothing to do with the category, but merely that you don't like that one item.
I point out that since multiple parties are making Android phones that if someone wants to make a one inch thick phone with a 12 MP sensor and 10X optical zoom and someone else wants to make a half inch thick phone with a 5MP sensor and a fixed lens, both will be available and the consumer can choose. The Apple consumer will have to buy the one available iPhone model and a $99 camera add on that is much larger and cumbersome. They still have that choice of course but I wouldn't call it an advantage that will alter buying decisions which is what you claimed. You claimed people would be buying iPhones instead of Android devices because they had plug in external batteries and external (cumbersome) devices that can be controlled via the 30 pin connector. That was your claim which is still unsupported.
I point out the importance of the 30 pin connector, which by the way, other manufacturers have been trying to force Apple to submit as a standard so they can all use it, and you say it doesn't matter.
I didn't say it doesn't matter. I said it is legacy and much of the functionality is being replaced by newer and better interfaces. Do you worry as much about a 30 pin connector when you have stereo bluetooth available and also the ability to control devices with bluetooth? No you don't. Could all the steering wheel functionality of controlling an iPod and having music from it go through the vehicle stereo system be duplicated now with bluetooth? Of course it could.
There's no way to counter such remarks, because they have no basis in any fact, just a biased opinion of yours.
It is a fact that microUSB, bluetooth and WIFI together can duplicate any functionality available via the 30 pin connector.
Your last post said nothing, just denials of the points I made.
You keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better.
It is a fact that microUSB, bluetooth and WIFI together can duplicate any functionality available via the 30 pin connector.
(Stewie voice) You see a lot of Motorola Droid car attachments, do ya? Come across a lot Docks for alarm clocks and home speakers and such for the Motorola Droid, eh? Reading NYTimes articles about Motorola Droid ecosystems, are we? Have entire aisles at your local electronic stores dedicated to adding to your Motorola Droid, hmm? Okay, okay? sure you do.
(Stewie voice) You see a lot of Motorola Droid car attachments, do ya? Come across a lot Docks for alarm clocks and home speakers and such for the Motorola Droid, eh? Reading NYTimes articles about Motorola Droid ecosystems, are we? Have entire aisles at your local electronic stores dedicated to adding to your Motorola Droid, hmm? Okay, okay? sure you do.
I don't see those for my Mac either compared to PC's yet I still love it to death.
It is interesting to see the arguments so reversed. Every Mac user knows that there are enough options available for that our platform to keep it enjoyable and usable. I don't need 500 first person shooters, I can be content with 50 of them.
The same is true with my iPhone and also any competitor to the iPhone that I would investigate. There only needs to be a critical mass of applications, accessories and what have you. Above that might be nice, but certainly not necessary.
Tell you what Sol, suggest some solutions to create an even deeper satisfaction with my iPhone. I very much like the bar that Android has where with a push of a button you can turn on and off items like wifi, bluetooth, locations services, etc. All in one handy widget.
Please find it for me so we can put another nail in the Android coffin.
You don't get what a personal attack is. It's not saying that a statement made is lame. It would be calling YOU lame, which I haven't done.
Just gotta go off on a tangent here. I agree with your description what of a personal attack is. Strange that I once had an infraction for exactly that. I clearly said another posters comments were such-and-such and got an infraction for it. When I asked for an explanation, lundy explicitly listed the adjectives I used to describe the posters comments as examples of ad homs. (I also said the poster was sad, which was also said to be an ad hom)
Puzzling. More puzzling was he then implied that my asking for the clarification was 'weird'.
So, sometimes, I guess criticizing a comment is considered a personal attack.
The original comment:
It's very funny that you would make such lame remarks.
See now if I wanted to be so obtuse about the intent of the posting guidelines, I could, for example say that it is very sad that you would take such terrible actions as a moderator.
By your reasoning, I've not violated the posting guidelines because I've only made comments about your actions, and not you personally. Attaching you and an action means you are describing the person.
So "You suck" for example would still be considered a comment on you, not really just describing an action you are taking.
So please now do us all a favor and stop mistreating people. Saying someone is lame or saying their typed phrase is lame isn't good reasoning in any form or fashion.
First, I will tell you that I never said that you violated anything. Secondly, if I said that you were lame, that would have been wrong. But despite what you are saying, there's nothing wrong in saying that your statements are lame. If you are offended so easily, I'm sorry you feel that way, but it's not an insult.
If you insist in misinterpreting things, it's not my fault.
I addressed them specifically and to be polite, you simply got upset about being proven wrong. You clearly didn't know that there are battery microUSB chargers and that they give any phone with a microUSB port the same capability you claimed was exclusive to the iPhone and thus an advantage rather than a disadvantage. Don't be a sore sport. I also linked to a $99 package to improve the iPhone video camera abilities and noted the very expensive GPS options. Those are not dismissals at all. They are actual products that address what was being discussed.
You really didn't. You dismissed an entire category of product because you dislike one item, or the cost of another. That's not a valid argument. We can dismiss any product category because we don't like one item. That doesn't make it a valid opinion.
I never said that micro chargers were the exclusive provence of the iPhone. YOU re saying I did.
What you said was that with a changeable battery, you would change it before a phone call, and so that made it better than the built-in battery of the iPhone. I pointed out that we could buy portable batteries to plug the iPhone into and could use the phone as we were doing so, which you couldn't do with a removable battery.
That was simply in response to your simple statement about having the advantage of a replaceable battery. I never said that there weren't portable batteries for other devices. I knew that there were, but you weren't taking about them. You were extolling the advantage of the changeable one to the disparagement of the iPhone. An advantage that doesn't exist..
Apple only differentiates the iPhone with the amount of RAM and you claimed this differentiation could occur via the 30 pin port. I simply noted that multiple Android hardware manufacturers could differentiate with their actual hardware rather than attempts to tack on strange contraptions to the one solution Apple offers.
There are two different concepts here. I have no problems with either existing.
But my argument with the way Android will be managed is that they will move apart over time, and so we won't be talking about Android devices so much as devices from different manufacturers. I stand by that. You can disagree if you want.
But we won't see what you're talking about with Android. Why would someone come out with a phone chemical sensor, as we see with that new device from NASA? They won't. It's not going to happen. And so Android serves no purpose in a device such as that when any Linux distro will do as well.
Ford was no different when selling only the Model T at one point and many car collectors can note the array of unique products that existed to deal with the shortcomings and desires to improve vehicle. Other companies that actually just introduced improved vehicles though didn't suffer from the lack of aftermarket products, they had the improvements already as part of the product.
We'll see. Apple does immensely well with it's iPod lines where they sell tens of millions of the same devices every year.
A phone is not a car. One might want to buy a $25,000 car every so often these days, but many people buy a new phone every year, two the most.
So far, there's no evidence that people are tired of Apple's basic phone design. Sales are still growing very quickly.
I really don't know exactly what you are thinking in terms of these Android devices as far as hardware goes. Give us some idea, other than a phone/computer. Exactly what device that's coming out for the iPhone would you see as an actual Android product?
You're saying that unlike the iPhone, which tens of millions will be buying each year, with some number of people buying hardware that will suit some need of theirs that can be attached and detached as needed, and left at home or work, you say that people will instead want to but many entire devices instead? Why would they do that?
You're going to have to explain this in some detail with some examples.
We ARE talking about phone/computing devices here remember. If what you're talking about doesn't include that as part of the product, it doesn't count.
I have gas sensing equipment now. I would be interested in buying an accessory that would allow my phone computer to do that, but not an entire phone with one built in.
I point out that since multiple parties are making Android phones that if someone wants to make a one inch thick phone with a 12 MP sensor and 10X optical zoom and someone else wants to make a half inch thick phone with a 5MP sensor and a fixed lens, both will be available and the consumer can choose. The Apple consumer will have to buy the one available iPhone model and a $99 camera add on that is much larger and cumbersome. They still have that choice of course but I wouldn't call it an advantage that will alter buying decisions which is what you claimed. You claimed people would be buying iPhones instead of Android devices because they had plug in external batteries and external (cumbersome) devices that can be controlled via the 30 pin connector. That was your claim which is still unsupported.
I can understand the concept of buying different phones by different people. But that's why Apple has such a large ecology of docking stations, from simple ones to go to your audio/video system, to entire systems. That's because all phones can fit. The problem with the many sizes scheme is, is that it makes it impossible for any one manufacturer, or esp any one phone to sell enough for a manufacturer to have an interest in making such devices.
And the fact that there as SO many shows that they are popular, and making money for their companies.
And yes, these things do have people wanting an iPhone (and iPods) so that they can buy the devices as well.
You're not going to see much of this for any other phones.
It's funny that you should think that the five seconds it takes to plug your phone into a dock is clumsy. Tell the millions of people who are buying these dockable devices that.
My "claim" isn't unsupported. You just aren't interested in acknowledging the many millions of devices sold for this purpose, and how it enhances the iPhone ownership experience.
And, by the way, you seem to be making the assumption that I think that every phone buyer in the world will be buying an iPhone. I don't think that. There will be people, likely a majority of them that will be buying other phones, possibly some form of Android phone.
All i'm saying is that Apple will continue to have a very successful product with very good sales.
If someone wants a phone with a 10 MP camera sensor, then fine, let them buy that instead.
I didn't say it doesn't matter. I said it is legacy and much of the functionality is being replaced by newer and better interfaces. Do you worry as much about a 30 pin connector when you have stereo bluetooth available and also the ability to control devices with bluetooth? No you don't. Could all the steering wheel functionality of controlling an iPod and having music from it go through the vehicle stereo system be duplicated now with bluetooth? Of course it could.
You may think it's legacy, but the new devices coming out all the time prove its not.
Neither USB or Bluetooth are in any way close to the usefulness of the connector Apple has. Neither allows the complete control over the phone by the device, or complete control of the device by the the phone.
It is a fact that microUSB, bluetooth and WIFI together can duplicate any functionality available via the 30 pin connector.
Not even close. None control anything.
Why don't you give some links to prove those contentions. Show how those communication protocols can control the device the way software and Apple's 30 pin connector can. If you can't then leave it alone.
We already have the evidence of what Apple can do. It's your turn.
Just gotta go off on a tangent here. I agree with your description what of a personal attack is. Strange that I once had an infraction for exactly that. I clearly said another posters comments were such-and-such and got an infraction for it. When I asked for an explanation, lundy explicitly listed the adjectives I used to describe the posters comments as examples of ad homs. (I also said the poster was sad, which was also said to be an ad hom)
Puzzling. More puzzling was he then implied that my asking for the clarification was 'weird'.
So, sometimes, I guess criticizing a comment is considered a personal attack.
I've never yet given anyone an infraction. I've asked them to not say things. I've edited posts, and removed a few. I rather PM people.
But we've ALL done stupid things. If someone says that was stupid, my response, would be, yeah, it was, I better be more careful. I know the person, as long as they don't have some vendetta, isn't calling me stupid.
Lundy bans people for saying something is factually untrue or makes no sense, and generally applies a level of moderation unlike anything else on AI-- something that the site seems to be in denial about, for some reason. Maybe the mods just kinda hate AO, in which case they should shut it down.
Your screen name is very suitable. Apparently, even you realize your limitations.
But then you show them in your posting as well. Very clever!
The only thing there that the iPhone doesn't do for third party apps is multitasking, which right now is limited to Apple's own apps, or a few third party ones such as Google Maps.
The rest are there, you just don't seem to know it.
Personal attacks (involving these about nickname, which you know nothing about the origin) shows that you are out of arguments, which is perfectly in-line with what you wrote : rubbish.
So congratulations to you : YOU WON. I am no longer trying to refute your apparent lies and FUDs.
Trying to put reasonable arguments only to see you either ignore them or post a nonsense as reply or personal attack, like in the last case, or combination of all of this, make me feel like talking to the brick wall. So enjoy your time there, global moderator, I am off.
Personal attacks (involving these about nickname, which you know nothing about the origin) shows that you are out of arguments, which is perfectly in-line with what you wrote : rubbish.
So congratulations to you : YOU WON. I am no longer trying to refute your apparent lies and FUDs.
Trying to put reasonable arguments only to see you either ignore them or post a nonsense as reply or personal attack, like in the last case, or combination of all of this, make me feel like talking to the brick wall. So enjoy your time there, global moderator, I am off.
Sure, whatever.
I think we should leave this for now, until either Motorola or Verizon decide to say something, or other more reliable numbers come out, as we're not going to settle this.
Looks like we got some solid numbers!
http://blog.flurry.com/bid/28266/Dro...e-Week-1-Sales
Basically like I've been saying, in between the 100,000 "Verizon store thumb guess" and 400,000 "what about the addition of sales from other resellers?" marks. Considering that the Droid only sold in the US on Verizon (as opposed to the 8 countries the 3GS sold in), I'd say that's really impressive.