Except the Courier concept is a huge break with established computing practice, and MS doesn't really do that. The video had a lot of blue-sky concepts around how data is handled that would require an entirely new OS-- moving things around by touch was the least of it. There was the kind of context sensitive OS level awareness that looks great when demoed around specific use-cases, but seems pretty unlikely when you consider a broader application. And how does that split screen hardware configuration work if you want to watch a full screen video? Seems like a pretty big drawback to have your device permanently split in half that way, even if you really want to run things full screen as big as possible. If there was a way of doing all that as an inexpensive day planner replacement, the kind of semi-dedicated device that people will pay a few hundred dollars for, then sure. But that's not going to happen.
I would say that that video was simply a compilation of a bunch of ideas (context sensitive flicking, 3D icon animations, gesture based text input handling, etc.), some of which may even find their way into shipping products.
But I don't think they'll even pretend that they're going to release something like the Courier concept.
Well said. When I saw the Courier video my first thought was "Hey, that's pretty neat." But as I continued to watch it I got the sense that they went about it backwards. There seemed to be a lot of ambiguous gestures that magically did exactly what they were supposed to in that video. It felt like they mapped out what they wanted it to do and then figured out what the gestures would be for each action later. It really didn't feel like they would have enough simple gestures for the amount of features they'd need to include, just enough for the demo.
If MS shows something that looks anything like that Courier concept I'll eat my hat. Expect to see a touch tablet with a little bit of case bling and a few bells and whistles, maybe running some version of WinCE for an OS and maybe with some Zune style animations. Probably Xbox ties ins, and pitched as an email/video/game/media device.
Not much different from the various small tablets that have been floating around for a while now, in other words, but MS probably feels like they have to at least pretend to have a dog in that hunt.
+1
...totally agree...can't wait to actually attend this years show instead of just drinking & gambling ....LOL
I actually downloaded the 2010 CES app for $1.99....lQQKS worth it!
I think the dual screen book concept is appealing. I like the idea of closing it to protect the screen and to turn it off, and opening it to use it. I could also be friends with the idea of building an app GUI standard where palettes and item settings appears on one screen and the meat is on the other screen. And I've always been pro stylus (in addition to touch) cuz I'm an illustrator and use it all the time. And frankly, if we're moving into heavier apps - more screen space is always appreciated.
It looks veeery ver thick though on this picture. Like... a book. And... I guess it's gonna be driven by some kind of Windows... So... good luck.
I think the dual screen book concept is appealing. I like the idea of closing it to protect the screen and to turn it off, and opening it to use it. I could also be friends with the idea of building an app GUI standard where palettes and item settings appears on one screen and the meat is on the other screen. And I've always been pro stylus (in addition to touch) cuz I'm an illustrator and use it all the time. And frankly, if we're moving into heavier apps - more screen space is always appreciated.
It looks veeery ver thick though on this picture. Like... a book. And... I guess it's gonna be driven by some kind of Windows... So... good luck.
The Courier is supposed to be powered by Windows 7, and seeing as how Windows 7 has gotten extremely well reception...how much luck they gonna need?
If something like the Courier is shown tomorrow, kudos to HP and Microsoft.
Still, I couldn't care less. The problem, and it's a big one, is it will still be a Windows machine. It will bring with it all that's inherently wrong and bad that operating system.
[CENTER]You do realize that it's the year 2010, not 2005?
Or is this simply a case of you having actually believed the anti-Windows rhetoric constantly featured in Apple's I'm A Mac commercials?
Either way, Windows 7 is fast, efficient, stable, and has yet to experience any cases of deleted guest account data or disabling previously installed software, so your arguments against it have been rendered entirely moot at this point.
Additionally: It's almost a given that whatever Hp/MS releases later today will have a full-featured operating system rather than some potentially questionable amalgamation of desktop/mobile phone operating systems locked into some kind of draconian ecosystem. [/CENTER]
Apple fanatics switch from Delusionberry Kool-Aid to Lemon Haterade
More at 11...
Seriously you guys are just ridiculous. If the Courier makes its appearance i expect a sock in everyones mouth. Apple's Tablet is even more vaporware than MS Courier (but i guess since everyone and their grandma talks about it...it MUST BE REAL?!!)
To put it like this, if they show off a physical Courier that did exactly what that video showcased awhile back and comes with a decent price tag...well this Magical Unicorn Tablet had better blow the doors off, cause i was definitely wowed by the Courier, so much in fact that i would sell my Hackintosh for one if it truly comes out this year.
Courier making an appearance is one thing. Shipping products are another. How it actually does, is yet another factor. Once these are in place then any rational person can decide whether the Apple Tablet is better than it or not or whatever.
Apple's Tablet can't be considered vaporware because it hasn't been announced in any way.
I was wowed by the Courier *concept* as well. I wouldn't mind getting one, but we'll still have to see how HP delivers on it and what the reviews are like.
The main thing is not whether Windows 7 is good or not. I have a Macbook Aluminium and my PC at home for gaming (AMD+ATI) runs Windows 7. It is, the best Windows ever and I would never touch anything less now.
However, what most people should pause to consider is, is it a good thing that the Courier runs Windows 7? We'll have to evaluate the touch-tablet-etc-functionality running on top of Windows 7 to see how things go.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifail
The Courier is supposed to be powered by Windows 7, and seeing as how Windows 7 has gotten extremely well reception...how much luck they gonna need?
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder
[CENTER]You do realize that it's the year 2010, not 2005?
Or is this simply a case of you having actually believed the anti-Windows rhetoric constantly featured in Apple's I'm A Mac commercials?
Either way, Windows 7 is fast, efficient, stable, and has yet to experience any cases of deleted guest account data or disabling previously installed software, so your arguments against it have been rendered entirely moot at this point.
Additionally: It's almost a given that whatever Hp/MS releases later today will have a full-featured operating system rather than some potentially questionable amalgamation of desktop/mobile phone operating systems locked into some kind of draconian ecosystem. [/CENTER]
Well said. When I saw the Courier video my first thought was "Hey, that's pretty neat." But as I continued to watch it I got the sense that they went about it backwards. There seemed to be a lot of ambiguous gestures that magically did exactly what they were supposed to in that video. It felt like they mapped out what they wanted it to do and then figured out what the gestures would be for each action later. It really didn't feel like they would have enough simple gestures for the amount of features they'd need to include, just enough for the demo.
I'd like to be open-minded and see what this Courier thing is about. But like I said, it depends whether this comes to fruition, how many they are actually shipping, what Android competitors may pop up, and what useability you get out of Courier.
I must be aging fast because this whole CES thing I couldn't give too much a damn about except for Arrandale benches, affordable (sub-$300) decent 256GB SSDs (no news of this), and a decent Tablet that isn't a half-baked prototype posing as a shipping, well-supported product.
Too much crap bollocks gadgets all over the place nowadays, netbooks still look ugly as anything... Maybe I'm on my way back to getting "a life".
The Courier is supposed to be powered by Windows 7, and seeing as how Windows 7 has gotten extremely well reception...how much luck they gonna need?
Excuse me? The "Courier" isn't running anything at all, beyond proof of concept rendered sequences designed to highlight some particular use-cases of some generalized thinking about UI possibilities.
Now if MS and HP release Yet Another Windows Tablet, running Windows 7, they're going to need the kind of luck that allows them to have any kind of success in the marketplace beyond the meager success they've had. Newly touch friendly or no, MS and its hardware partners have been making these things for years without much interest from the buying public.
The main thing is not whether Windows 7 is good or not. I have a Macbook Aluminium and my PC at home for gaming (AMD+ATI) runs Windows 7. It is, the best Windows ever and I would never touch anything less now.
However, what most people should pause to consider is, is it a good thing that the Courier runs Windows 7? We'll have to evaluate the touch-tablet-etc-functionality running on top of Windows 7 to see how things go.
[CENTER]Full Touch Screen functionality is built directly into Windows 7, and the family PC is an Hp TouchSmart 600 series which runs brilliantly.
You might also want to take a look at the touscreen implementation of Hp's new TM2 as it redefines user interaction on these kind of devices.
Hp/MS has been in the touchscreen computer for quite some time and that experience appears to be paying off.[/CENTER]
[CENTER]You do realize that it's the year 2010, not 2005?
Or is this simply a case of you having actually believed the anti-Windows rhetoric constantly featured in Apple's I'm A Mac commercials?
Either way, Windows 7 is fast, efficient, stable, and has yet to experience any cases of deleted guest account data or disabling previously installed software, so your arguments against it have been rendered entirely moot at this point.
Additionally: It's almost a given that whatever Hp/MS releases later today will have a full-featured operating system rather than some potentially questionable amalgamation of desktop/mobile phone operating systems locked into some kind of draconian ecosystem. [/CENTER]
There have long been tablets with MS "full-featured" OSes. They don't seem to have gone over very well. Possibly because "full-featured" operating systems that are fundamentally desktop centric with some touch stuff bolted on aren't actually very good at anything.
Tailoring an iteration of a flexible, extensible OS for the particular hardware at hand isn't potentially questionable (unless you're a bit dim), it's the smart way to go.
By the way, why is everyone talking about the "Courier", as if that was had been announced? MS just said they'd have an HP tablet to show.
Courier making an appearance is one thing. Shipping products are another. How it actually does, is yet another factor. Once these are in place then any rational person can decide whether the Apple Tablet is better than it or not or whatever.
Apple's Tablet can't be considered vaporware because it hasn't been announced in any way.
I was wowed by the Courier *concept* as well. I wouldn't mind getting one, but we'll still have to see how HP delivers on it and what the reviews are like.
Sound's like you're into the Haterade.
The Courier factors into the style i happen to like... similar to a laptop, but all touchscreen and everything is built into one, and i personally would rather have something that folds than just an open screen, and iirc the Courier is supposed to be 2 7" screens but those were talks from last year.
All the dismissive talk about the Courier simply because it is MS is what agitates me the most, blindly aggressive to anything not Apple for no reason is about as stupid as all the Blackberry fanatics who dismiss anything not RIM as inferior.
As for the Courier manufacturer, HP makes decent stuff...i played around with their touchscreen desktop PC, i would never buy it since i find such a thing to be pointless in a desktop. It was pretty responsive but i hope whatever hardware it has isnt something absurd like a Atom processor, i've had enough of my 10v Mini one to be honest. A 64bit processor would be nice, but im thinking we might see a Tegra or something similar in there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008
The main thing is not whether Windows 7 is good or not. I have a Macbook Aluminium and my PC at home for gaming (AMD+ATI) runs Windows 7. It is, the best Windows ever and I would never touch anything less now.
However, what most people should pause to consider is, is it a good thing that the Courier runs Windows 7? We'll have to evaluate the touch-tablet-etc-functionality running on top of Windows 7 to see how things go.
Well having Windows 7 foundations gives it a good place to start at, because their tablet software needs it. Iirc Microsoft Surface runs on Windows 7, but i havent exactly seen reviews of said product
The TM2 has a gimmicky UI shell that uses a "toss" gesture for moving files around. It hardly "redefines" much of anything.
And I have no idea what "full touch screen functionality" even means, and I doubt that you do either, beyond being addicted to ad copy speak.
[CENTER]Conversely, many find Apple's implementation of 'pinch-to-zoom' rather gimmicky and redundant given that the same action is made possible via a simple 'double-tap', and I won't even address the senselessness of 'cover-flow'.
See How That Works?
The primary reason that you have no idea what 'full touch screen functionality' means is due to the fact that if it isn't by Apple you quickly dismiss it as irrelevant...
That is until Apple finally gets around to incorporating said technology into their wares.
Here's what it means: The computer can be controlled entirely via the touch screen, as is the case with Hp's TouchSmart line of PCs. [/CENTER]
Excuse me? The "Courier" isn't running anything at all, beyond proof of concept rendered sequences designed to highlight some particular use-cases of some generalized thinking about UI possibilities.
Now if MS and HP release Yet Another Windows Tablet, running Windows 7, they're going to need the kind of luck that allows them to have any kind of success in the marketplace beyond the meager success they've had. Newly touch friendly or no, MS and its hardware partners have been making these things for years without much interest from the buying public.
You mad dawg? You seem to be upset that MS has thought up some nifty designs for a product they might make. I hope you dont get this bent out of shape over Apple Patent speculations It was a showcase of what can/could be done...you need to see a task manager or file sizes to make it legit?
Windows and Xbox 360...meager success stories i guess but anyways to the point, IF Microsoft shows off some ho-hum tablet....there will be quite a few pissed people out there and im sure the product will be obscured very quickly when the yet elusive Apple Tablet appears
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox
There have long been tablets with MS "full-featured" OSes. They don't seem to have gone over very well. Possibly because "full-featured" operating systems that are fundamentally desktop centric with some touch stuff bolted on aren't actually very good at anything.
Tailoring an iteration of a flexible, extensible OS for the particular hardware at hand isn't potentially questionable (unless you're a bit dim), it's the smart way to go.
By the way, why is everyone talking about the "Courier", as if that was had been announced? MS just said they'd have an HP tablet to show.
OR the reason why tablets have sucked is because no one has had a use for one...at all. Why would one want just a screen that is meagerly equipped when I could have a laptop that does the exact same thing? Now were into this E-Book market, and people are looking to capitalize.
Still thats not enough for me, im expecting atleast Netbook capabilities and then some for me to plunk out my money for one of these, because it would be replacing my hackintosh (but with that said, i wouldn't expect to run CS4 or Crysis on something like this).
Oh and talk of the Courier has spruced up real fast because MS happend to have that concept video from last year and this could be the opening salvo against Apple and its tablet (which has been all the rage..for the past 6 months) if it does indeed turn out to be the Courier, as many people were impressed by it.
Now if it isnt the Courier, not only will i be severely disappointed but i'll be the first one on here to call Microsoft out for that f*ck up.
The Courier factors into the style i happen to like... similar to a laptop, but all touchscreen and everything is built into one, and i personally would rather have something that folds than just an open screen, and iirc the Courier is supposed to be 2 7" screens but those were talks from last year.
All the dismissive talk about the Courier simply because it is MS is what agitates me the most, blindly aggressive to anything not Apple for no reason is about as stupid as all the Blackberry fanatics who dismiss anything not RIM as inferior.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm dismissive about the "Courier" not because MS made the video but because it's so clearly nothing but a video. Which hasn't kept MS fanboys from trumpeting the slaughter of Apple at the hands of a resurgent Redmond, or something, and carrying on about what a triumph "it" is, which is pretty irritating in its own right. If all it took to dominate a market was a slick demo video, Minority Report would be the largest maker of computers in the world.
Quote:
Well having Windows 7 foundations gives it a good place to start at, because their tablet software needs it. Iirc Microsoft Surface runs on Windows 7, but i havent exactly seen reviews of said product
The problem being is that a functional, easy to use tablet really needs a complete rethink of the entire experience, not just a redressed and touch enabled version of a desktop OS. Your admiration for the Courier video is tacit agreement on this point-- what was shown is by no stretch of the imagination "Windows 7", no matter how much it has embraced touch optimization.
Windows fans seem to want to have it both ways-- a "real operating system" in Windows 7, but a radical reworking of what that means, ala the Courier video. I guess as long as its all imaginary you can kind of paper over the vast disparity between those two ideas, but a functioning device is going to have to confront reality.
At the same time, there seems to be a desire to label anything less than full, desktop OS X on an Apple device as "crippled" or "compromised", but that just exactly misses the point.
You mad dawg? You seem to be upset that MS has thought up some nifty designs for a product they might make. I hope you dont get this bent out of shape over Apple Patent speculations It was a showcase of what can/could be done...you need to see a task manager or file sizes to make it legit?
I have no idea why you think pointing out that a video isn't anything more than concept makes me mad or bent out of shape.
Quote:
Windows and Xbox 360...meager success stories i guess but anyways to the point, IF Microsoft shows off some ho-hum tablet....there will be quite a few pissed people out there and im sure the product will be obscured very quickly when the yet elusive Apple Tablet appears
I would guess that there will be some distinguishing features to their tablet, that there will brief enthusiasm in the tech press, and that no one in normal life will much care.
Quote:
OR the reason why tablets have sucked is because no one has had a use for one...at all. Why would one want just a screen that is meagerly equipped when I could have a laptop that does the exact same thing? Now were into this E-Book market, and people are looking to capitalize.
Still thats not enough for me, im expecting atleast Netbook capabilities and then some for me to plunk out my money for one of these, because it would be replacing my hackintosh (but with that said, i wouldn't expect to run CS4 or Crysis on something like this).
Well, that's an interesting chicken and egg question. Tablets haven't been appealing because they don't serve a purpose because they're not appealing.
"Appealing" isn't just cosmetics, it has to do with how a device is perceived, how it fits into ones life, how the user relates to it, and how easy it is to just pick up and use. I would guess that all of those things were at the forefront of Apple's mind when they were designing their whatever it is.
MS and its hardware partners apparently do not think like this, so it's no wonder their tablets haven't caught on. It's like "Look! The Windows you know and love, with touch! On a flat thing!"
Quote:
Oh and talk of the Courier has spruced up real fast because MS happend to have that concept video from last year and this could be the opening salvo against Apple and its tablet (which has been all the rage..for the past 6 months) if it does indeed turn out to be the Courier, as many people were impressed by it.
Now if it isnt the Courier, not only will i be severely disappointed but i'll be the first one on here to call Microsoft out for that f*ck up.
Are you sure about that? What was shown seemed to be the very definition of a niche device-- a thing that builds its possible uses into the hardware, disallowing a bunch of other uses. I mean, if you really need a journal/scrap book/research/PIM that's great, but I don't see that as being the breakthrough form factor.
At any rate, I don't think MS is under any obligation to release a "Courier", since all they did was make a video without any claims to planning to build the thing.
Apple fanatics switch from Delusionberry Kool-Aid to Lemon Haterade
More at 11...
Seriously you guys are just ridiculous. If the Courier makes its appearance i expect a sock in everyones mouth. Apple's Tablet is even more vaporware than MS Courier (but i guess since everyone and their grandma talks about it...it MUST BE REAL?!!)
To put it like this, if they show off a physical Courier that did exactly what that video showcased awhile back and comes with a decent price tag...well this Magical Unicorn Tablet had better blow the doors off, cause i was definitely wowed by the Courier, so much in fact that i would sell my Hackintosh for one if it truly comes out this year.
In order for Apple's rumoured tablet to be vaporware, wouldn't Apple have had to have formally made some comment in the first place?
I mean, this is so sad, really, when Apple hasn't even officially announced that it is holding a presser at the end of the month and now is being accused, it would seem, of trying to put one over on us poor consumers.
The fact that unsubstantiated rumours of Apple conjuring up a 10-inch tablet have been circulating for more than a year should be clue enough that whatever Apple has planned for 2010, a 10-inch tablet probably isn't it. Do you really think Apple would let the world in on what it has planned for more than a year, giving the competition ample time to dream up a preemptive strike? Not likely.
I think, though, that it's a no-brainer to conclude that Apple will not stand still in the portable space. They're not done tinkering and probably never will be. Guess we'll just have to wait a while and see how it all plays out.
In order for Apple's rumoured tablet to be vaporware, wouldn't Apple have had to have formally made some comment in the first place?
In order for Microsoft's rumoured tablet to be vaporware, wouldn't Microsoft have had to have formally made some comment in the first place?
Quote:
I mean, this is so sad, really, when Apple hasn't even officially announced that it is holding a presser at the end of the month and now is being accused, it would seem, of trying to put one over on us poor consumers.
I mean, this is so sad, really, when Microsoft hasn't even officially announced that it is holding a presser at the end of the month and now is being accused, it would seem, of trying to put one over on us poor consumers.
Comments
Except the Courier concept is a huge break with established computing practice, and MS doesn't really do that. The video had a lot of blue-sky concepts around how data is handled that would require an entirely new OS-- moving things around by touch was the least of it. There was the kind of context sensitive OS level awareness that looks great when demoed around specific use-cases, but seems pretty unlikely when you consider a broader application. And how does that split screen hardware configuration work if you want to watch a full screen video? Seems like a pretty big drawback to have your device permanently split in half that way, even if you really want to run things full screen as big as possible. If there was a way of doing all that as an inexpensive day planner replacement, the kind of semi-dedicated device that people will pay a few hundred dollars for, then sure. But that's not going to happen.
I would say that that video was simply a compilation of a bunch of ideas (context sensitive flicking, 3D icon animations, gesture based text input handling, etc.), some of which may even find their way into shipping products.
But I don't think they'll even pretend that they're going to release something like the Courier concept.
Well said. When I saw the Courier video my first thought was "Hey, that's pretty neat." But as I continued to watch it I got the sense that they went about it backwards. There seemed to be a lot of ambiguous gestures that magically did exactly what they were supposed to in that video. It felt like they mapped out what they wanted it to do and then figured out what the gestures would be for each action later. It really didn't feel like they would have enough simple gestures for the amount of features they'd need to include, just enough for the demo.
If MS shows something that looks anything like that Courier concept I'll eat my hat. Expect to see a touch tablet with a little bit of case bling and a few bells and whistles, maybe running some version of WinCE for an OS and maybe with some Zune style animations. Probably Xbox ties ins, and pitched as an email/video/game/media device.
Not much different from the various small tablets that have been floating around for a while now, in other words, but MS probably feels like they have to at least pretend to have a dog in that hunt.
+1
...totally agree...can't wait to actually attend this years show instead of just drinking & gambling ....LOL
I actually downloaded the 2010 CES app for $1.99....lQQKS worth it!
It looks veeery ver thick though on this picture. Like... a book. And... I guess it's gonna be driven by some kind of Windows... So... good luck.
I think the dual screen book concept is appealing. I like the idea of closing it to protect the screen and to turn it off, and opening it to use it. I could also be friends with the idea of building an app GUI standard where palettes and item settings appears on one screen and the meat is on the other screen. And I've always been pro stylus (in addition to touch) cuz I'm an illustrator and use it all the time. And frankly, if we're moving into heavier apps - more screen space is always appreciated.
It looks veeery ver thick though on this picture. Like... a book. And... I guess it's gonna be driven by some kind of Windows... So... good luck.
The Courier is supposed to be powered by Windows 7, and seeing as how Windows 7 has gotten extremely well reception...how much luck they gonna need?
Me too.
If something like the Courier is shown tomorrow, kudos to HP and Microsoft.
Still, I couldn't care less. The problem, and it's a big one, is it will still be a Windows machine. It will bring with it all that's inherently wrong and bad that operating system.
[CENTER]You do realize that it's the year 2010, not 2005?
Or is this simply a case of you having actually believed the anti-Windows rhetoric constantly featured in Apple's I'm A Mac commercials?
Either way, Windows 7 is fast, efficient, stable, and has yet to experience any cases of deleted guest account data or disabling previously installed software, so your arguments against it have been rendered entirely moot at this point.
Additionally: It's almost a given that whatever Hp/MS releases later today will have a full-featured operating system rather than some potentially questionable amalgamation of desktop/mobile phone operating systems locked into some kind of draconian ecosystem. [/CENTER]
BREAKING NEWS STORY!!!
Apple fanatics switch from Delusionberry Kool-Aid to Lemon Haterade
More at 11...
Seriously you guys are just ridiculous. If the Courier makes its appearance i expect a sock in everyones mouth. Apple's Tablet is even more vaporware than MS Courier (but i guess since everyone and their grandma talks about it...it MUST BE REAL?!!)
To put it like this, if they show off a physical Courier that did exactly what that video showcased awhile back and comes with a decent price tag...well this Magical Unicorn Tablet had better blow the doors off, cause i was definitely wowed by the Courier, so much in fact that i would sell my Hackintosh for one if it truly comes out this year.
Courier making an appearance is one thing. Shipping products are another. How it actually does, is yet another factor. Once these are in place then any rational person can decide whether the Apple Tablet is better than it or not or whatever.
Apple's Tablet can't be considered vaporware because it hasn't been announced in any way.
I was wowed by the Courier *concept* as well. I wouldn't mind getting one, but we'll still have to see how HP delivers on it and what the reviews are like.
Sound's like you're into the Haterade.
However, what most people should pause to consider is, is it a good thing that the Courier runs Windows 7? We'll have to evaluate the touch-tablet-etc-functionality running on top of Windows 7 to see how things go.
The Courier is supposed to be powered by Windows 7, and seeing as how Windows 7 has gotten extremely well reception...how much luck they gonna need?
[CENTER]You do realize that it's the year 2010, not 2005?
Or is this simply a case of you having actually believed the anti-Windows rhetoric constantly featured in Apple's I'm A Mac commercials?
Either way, Windows 7 is fast, efficient, stable, and has yet to experience any cases of deleted guest account data or disabling previously installed software, so your arguments against it have been rendered entirely moot at this point.
Additionally: It's almost a given that whatever Hp/MS releases later today will have a full-featured operating system rather than some potentially questionable amalgamation of desktop/mobile phone operating systems locked into some kind of draconian ecosystem. [/CENTER]
Well said. When I saw the Courier video my first thought was "Hey, that's pretty neat." But as I continued to watch it I got the sense that they went about it backwards. There seemed to be a lot of ambiguous gestures that magically did exactly what they were supposed to in that video. It felt like they mapped out what they wanted it to do and then figured out what the gestures would be for each action later. It really didn't feel like they would have enough simple gestures for the amount of features they'd need to include, just enough for the demo.
I'd like to be open-minded and see what this Courier thing is about. But like I said, it depends whether this comes to fruition, how many they are actually shipping, what Android competitors may pop up, and what useability you get out of Courier.
I must be aging fast because this whole CES thing I couldn't give too much a damn about except for Arrandale benches, affordable (sub-$300) decent 256GB SSDs (no news of this), and a decent Tablet that isn't a half-baked prototype posing as a shipping, well-supported product.
Too much crap bollocks gadgets all over the place nowadays, netbooks still look ugly as anything... Maybe I'm on my way back to getting "a life".
The Courier is supposed to be powered by Windows 7, and seeing as how Windows 7 has gotten extremely well reception...how much luck they gonna need?
Excuse me? The "Courier" isn't running anything at all, beyond proof of concept rendered sequences designed to highlight some particular use-cases of some generalized thinking about UI possibilities.
Now if MS and HP release Yet Another Windows Tablet, running Windows 7, they're going to need the kind of luck that allows them to have any kind of success in the marketplace beyond the meager success they've had. Newly touch friendly or no, MS and its hardware partners have been making these things for years without much interest from the buying public.
The main thing is not whether Windows 7 is good or not. I have a Macbook Aluminium and my PC at home for gaming (AMD+ATI) runs Windows 7. It is, the best Windows ever and I would never touch anything less now.
However, what most people should pause to consider is, is it a good thing that the Courier runs Windows 7? We'll have to evaluate the touch-tablet-etc-functionality running on top of Windows 7 to see how things go.
[CENTER]Full Touch Screen functionality is built directly into Windows 7, and the family PC is an Hp TouchSmart 600 series which runs brilliantly.
You might also want to take a look at the touscreen implementation of Hp's new TM2 as it redefines user interaction on these kind of devices.
Hp/MS has been in the touchscreen computer for quite some time and that experience appears to be paying off.[/CENTER]
[CENTER]You do realize that it's the year 2010, not 2005?
Or is this simply a case of you having actually believed the anti-Windows rhetoric constantly featured in Apple's I'm A Mac commercials?
Either way, Windows 7 is fast, efficient, stable, and has yet to experience any cases of deleted guest account data or disabling previously installed software, so your arguments against it have been rendered entirely moot at this point.
Additionally: It's almost a given that whatever Hp/MS releases later today will have a full-featured operating system rather than some potentially questionable amalgamation of desktop/mobile phone operating systems locked into some kind of draconian ecosystem. [/CENTER]
There have long been tablets with MS "full-featured" OSes. They don't seem to have gone over very well. Possibly because "full-featured" operating systems that are fundamentally desktop centric with some touch stuff bolted on aren't actually very good at anything.
Tailoring an iteration of a flexible, extensible OS for the particular hardware at hand isn't potentially questionable (unless you're a bit dim), it's the smart way to go.
By the way, why is everyone talking about the "Courier", as if that was had been announced? MS just said they'd have an HP tablet to show.
[CENTER]Full Touch Screen functionality is built directly into Windows 7, and the family PC is an Hp TouchSmart 600 series which runs brilliantly.
You might also want to take a look at the touscreen implementation of Hp's new TM2 as it redefines user interaction on these kind of devices.
Hp/MS has been in the touchscreen computer for quite some time and that experience appears to be paying off.[/CENTER]
The TM2 has a gimmicky UI shell that uses a "toss" gesture for moving files around. It hardly "redefines" much of anything.
And I have no idea what "full touch screen functionality" even means, and I doubt that you do either, beyond being addicted to ad copy speak.
Courier making an appearance is one thing. Shipping products are another. How it actually does, is yet another factor. Once these are in place then any rational person can decide whether the Apple Tablet is better than it or not or whatever.
Apple's Tablet can't be considered vaporware because it hasn't been announced in any way.
I was wowed by the Courier *concept* as well. I wouldn't mind getting one, but we'll still have to see how HP delivers on it and what the reviews are like.
Sound's like you're into the Haterade.
The Courier factors into the style i happen to like... similar to a laptop, but all touchscreen and everything is built into one, and i personally would rather have something that folds than just an open screen, and iirc the Courier is supposed to be 2 7" screens but those were talks from last year.
All the dismissive talk about the Courier simply because it is MS is what agitates me the most, blindly aggressive to anything not Apple for no reason is about as stupid as all the Blackberry fanatics who dismiss anything not RIM as inferior.
As for the Courier manufacturer, HP makes decent stuff...i played around with their touchscreen desktop PC, i would never buy it since i find such a thing to be pointless in a desktop. It was pretty responsive but i hope whatever hardware it has isnt something absurd like a Atom processor, i've had enough of my 10v Mini one to be honest. A 64bit processor would be nice, but im thinking we might see a Tegra or something similar in there.
The main thing is not whether Windows 7 is good or not. I have a Macbook Aluminium and my PC at home for gaming (AMD+ATI) runs Windows 7. It is, the best Windows ever and I would never touch anything less now.
However, what most people should pause to consider is, is it a good thing that the Courier runs Windows 7? We'll have to evaluate the touch-tablet-etc-functionality running on top of Windows 7 to see how things go.
Well having Windows 7 foundations gives it a good place to start at, because their tablet software needs it. Iirc Microsoft Surface runs on Windows 7, but i havent exactly seen reviews of said product
The TM2 has a gimmicky UI shell that uses a "toss" gesture for moving files around. It hardly "redefines" much of anything.
And I have no idea what "full touch screen functionality" even means, and I doubt that you do either, beyond being addicted to ad copy speak.
[CENTER]Conversely, many find Apple's implementation of 'pinch-to-zoom' rather gimmicky and redundant given that the same action is made possible via a simple 'double-tap', and I won't even address the senselessness of 'cover-flow'.
See How That Works?
The primary reason that you have no idea what 'full touch screen functionality' means is due to the fact that if it isn't by Apple you quickly dismiss it as irrelevant...
That is until Apple finally gets around to incorporating said technology into their wares.
Here's what it means: The computer can be controlled entirely via the touch screen, as is the case with Hp's TouchSmart line of PCs. [/CENTER]
Excuse me? The "Courier" isn't running anything at all, beyond proof of concept rendered sequences designed to highlight some particular use-cases of some generalized thinking about UI possibilities.
Now if MS and HP release Yet Another Windows Tablet, running Windows 7, they're going to need the kind of luck that allows them to have any kind of success in the marketplace beyond the meager success they've had. Newly touch friendly or no, MS and its hardware partners have been making these things for years without much interest from the buying public.
You mad dawg? You seem to be upset that MS has thought up some nifty designs for a product they might make. I hope you dont get this bent out of shape over Apple Patent speculations
Windows and Xbox 360...meager success stories i guess but anyways to the point, IF Microsoft shows off some ho-hum tablet....there will be quite a few pissed people out there and im sure the product will be obscured very quickly when the yet elusive Apple Tablet appears
There have long been tablets with MS "full-featured" OSes. They don't seem to have gone over very well. Possibly because "full-featured" operating systems that are fundamentally desktop centric with some touch stuff bolted on aren't actually very good at anything.
Tailoring an iteration of a flexible, extensible OS for the particular hardware at hand isn't potentially questionable (unless you're a bit dim), it's the smart way to go.
By the way, why is everyone talking about the "Courier", as if that was had been announced? MS just said they'd have an HP tablet to show.
OR the reason why tablets have sucked is because no one has had a use for one...at all. Why would one want just a screen that is meagerly equipped when I could have a laptop that does the exact same thing? Now were into this E-Book market, and people are looking to capitalize.
Still thats not enough for me, im expecting atleast Netbook capabilities and then some for me to plunk out my money for one of these, because it would be replacing my hackintosh (but with that said, i wouldn't expect to run CS4 or Crysis on something like this).
Oh and talk of the Courier has spruced up real fast because MS happend to have that concept video from last year and this could be the opening salvo against Apple and its tablet (which has been all the rage..for the past 6 months) if it does indeed turn out to be the Courier, as many people were impressed by it.
Now if it isnt the Courier, not only will i be severely disappointed but i'll be the first one on here to call Microsoft out for that f*ck up.
The Courier factors into the style i happen to like... similar to a laptop, but all touchscreen and everything is built into one, and i personally would rather have something that folds than just an open screen, and iirc the Courier is supposed to be 2 7" screens but those were talks from last year.
All the dismissive talk about the Courier simply because it is MS is what agitates me the most, blindly aggressive to anything not Apple for no reason is about as stupid as all the Blackberry fanatics who dismiss anything not RIM as inferior.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm dismissive about the "Courier" not because MS made the video but because it's so clearly nothing but a video. Which hasn't kept MS fanboys from trumpeting the slaughter of Apple at the hands of a resurgent Redmond, or something, and carrying on about what a triumph "it" is, which is pretty irritating in its own right. If all it took to dominate a market was a slick demo video, Minority Report would be the largest maker of computers in the world.
Well having Windows 7 foundations gives it a good place to start at, because their tablet software needs it. Iirc Microsoft Surface runs on Windows 7, but i havent exactly seen reviews of said product
The problem being is that a functional, easy to use tablet really needs a complete rethink of the entire experience, not just a redressed and touch enabled version of a desktop OS. Your admiration for the Courier video is tacit agreement on this point-- what was shown is by no stretch of the imagination "Windows 7", no matter how much it has embraced touch optimization.
Windows fans seem to want to have it both ways-- a "real operating system" in Windows 7, but a radical reworking of what that means, ala the Courier video. I guess as long as its all imaginary you can kind of paper over the vast disparity between those two ideas, but a functioning device is going to have to confront reality.
At the same time, there seems to be a desire to label anything less than full, desktop OS X on an Apple device as "crippled" or "compromised", but that just exactly misses the point.
You mad dawg? You seem to be upset that MS has thought up some nifty designs for a product they might make. I hope you dont get this bent out of shape over Apple Patent speculations
I have no idea why you think pointing out that a video isn't anything more than concept makes me mad or bent out of shape.
Windows and Xbox 360...meager success stories i guess but anyways to the point, IF Microsoft shows off some ho-hum tablet....there will be quite a few pissed people out there and im sure the product will be obscured very quickly when the yet elusive Apple Tablet appears
I would guess that there will be some distinguishing features to their tablet, that there will brief enthusiasm in the tech press, and that no one in normal life will much care.
OR the reason why tablets have sucked is because no one has had a use for one...at all. Why would one want just a screen that is meagerly equipped when I could have a laptop that does the exact same thing? Now were into this E-Book market, and people are looking to capitalize.
Still thats not enough for me, im expecting atleast Netbook capabilities and then some for me to plunk out my money for one of these, because it would be replacing my hackintosh (but with that said, i wouldn't expect to run CS4 or Crysis on something like this).
Well, that's an interesting chicken and egg question. Tablets haven't been appealing because they don't serve a purpose because they're not appealing.
"Appealing" isn't just cosmetics, it has to do with how a device is perceived, how it fits into ones life, how the user relates to it, and how easy it is to just pick up and use. I would guess that all of those things were at the forefront of Apple's mind when they were designing their whatever it is.
MS and its hardware partners apparently do not think like this, so it's no wonder their tablets haven't caught on. It's like "Look! The Windows you know and love, with touch! On a flat thing!"
Oh and talk of the Courier has spruced up real fast because MS happend to have that concept video from last year and this could be the opening salvo against Apple and its tablet (which has been all the rage..for the past 6 months) if it does indeed turn out to be the Courier, as many people were impressed by it.
Now if it isnt the Courier, not only will i be severely disappointed but i'll be the first one on here to call Microsoft out for that f*ck up.
Are you sure about that? What was shown seemed to be the very definition of a niche device-- a thing that builds its possible uses into the hardware, disallowing a bunch of other uses. I mean, if you really need a journal/scrap book/research/PIM that's great, but I don't see that as being the breakthrough form factor.
At any rate, I don't think MS is under any obligation to release a "Courier", since all they did was make a video without any claims to planning to build the thing.
But my guess is that this will simply be a keyboard-less Windows 7 UMPC.
And instead of a stylus, you can use your finger(s).
We already know what the market thinks of such devices. See Project Origami.
C.
BREAKING NEWS STORY!!!
Apple fanatics switch from Delusionberry Kool-Aid to Lemon Haterade
More at 11...
Seriously you guys are just ridiculous. If the Courier makes its appearance i expect a sock in everyones mouth. Apple's Tablet is even more vaporware than MS Courier (but i guess since everyone and their grandma talks about it...it MUST BE REAL?!!)
To put it like this, if they show off a physical Courier that did exactly what that video showcased awhile back and comes with a decent price tag...well this Magical Unicorn Tablet had better blow the doors off, cause i was definitely wowed by the Courier, so much in fact that i would sell my Hackintosh for one if it truly comes out this year.
In order for Apple's rumoured tablet to be vaporware, wouldn't Apple have had to have formally made some comment in the first place?
I mean, this is so sad, really, when Apple hasn't even officially announced that it is holding a presser at the end of the month and now is being accused, it would seem, of trying to put one over on us poor consumers.
The fact that unsubstantiated rumours of Apple conjuring up a 10-inch tablet have been circulating for more than a year should be clue enough that whatever Apple has planned for 2010, a 10-inch tablet probably isn't it. Do you really think Apple would let the world in on what it has planned for more than a year, giving the competition ample time to dream up a preemptive strike? Not likely.
I think, though, that it's a no-brainer to conclude that Apple will not stand still in the portable space. They're not done tinkering and probably never will be. Guess we'll just have to wait a while and see how it all plays out.
In order for Apple's rumoured tablet to be vaporware, wouldn't Apple have had to have formally made some comment in the first place?
In order for Microsoft's rumoured tablet to be vaporware, wouldn't Microsoft have had to have formally made some comment in the first place?
I mean, this is so sad, really, when Apple hasn't even officially announced that it is holding a presser at the end of the month and now is being accused, it would seem, of trying to put one over on us poor consumers.
I mean, this is so sad, really, when Microsoft hasn't even officially announced that it is holding a presser at the end of the month and now is being accused, it would seem, of trying to put one over on us poor consumers.