So we've gone from "the iPad isn't a personal computer because you have to connect it to a Mac/PC running iTunes to activate it" to "iPads aren't personal computers because they can't do as much as Mac OS/Windows"? I guess that makes only Windows tablets personal computers, but what about Windows 8 that will ue a new UI specifically for the touch UI?
Sounds like a lot of sour grapes to me. The idea that it's not a personal computer unless users can have carte blanche access to delete root files that will brick their machine is a pretty lame excuse. I'd think the term personal would be a big enough clue as to what a personal computer is. After all, the iPad does a lot more and is a lot more powerful than most of the history of "PC"s.
Ultimately, the reason why I think iPads should be included into PC marketshare is because someone- albeit a limited sliver of the market, IS buying the iPad as a PC replacement. That being the case- how can it NOT be included in the same category?
I could replace my car with a motorcycle. It does roughly the same job. However, a motorcycle will never be a car. It has different characteristics.
I also suspect that some people are replacing their PC with a smartphone. Again, that doesn't mean that a smartphone is a PC. It has different characteristics.
So many personal computers are used for transacting email and playing games on and that's it. What makes those systems special in ways that the iPad isn't? In fact, a lot of PC users would benefit greatly by dropping the useless box of Windows junk and going to an iPad instead.
I could reply to at least 6 posts here with the same opinion as above.
Fact: I'm switching over people over from WinXP boxes and assorted laptop trash, to iPad's at almost 1/day.
Fact: every single one of those people are thanking me continuously, and love their "NEW COMPUTER"!
Their words, not mine. So. If the average person on the street: moms, kids, business people (sales mostly), seniors, etc. all call it a "computer", should it not be counted as such?
PS. I must admit, that many people also correct themselves and say, "iPad" after a moment. It must really "P' the geeks off... because you know, outside of America, tablet and slate don't translate well, and similar to "Kleenex" and a "Xerox", iPad is what anything like it, is nominally called.
The term PC will disappear into yesteryear. It was coined in an age long gone and is a term that, as the iPad has shown, is becoming less and less relevant every day. Hopefully, it will take at least some trolls with it.
Agreed. The term PC has, for many reasons, become increasingly irrelevant.
However, we still have the problem of whether or not we lump tablet computer sales with desktop, laptop and netbook computer sales to come up with a total "personal computer" (NOT Personal Computer") sales figure.
An iPad is much more capable than a PC manufactured in 1999. Should we rename older PCs to no longer be called PCs?
My opinion: if netbooks are included in the total, then tablet computers should be too, as they serve most of the functions of a netbook and are displacing them.
BTW, tablet computer sales always were included in PC sales totals before the iPad came out. Why change now?
The argument to this article is if the iPad is a computer?
Who cares, I mean really... is it that big of a deal if and iPad is or is not a computer?
People are getting insulting because they disagree if an iPad is a computer?
Wow....
Yes, because the entire point of the article is about sales figures based on how the iPad is classified. The same thing happens when you compare Apple to a single other smartphone vendor vs comparing Apple to Android which includes all vendors. If the iPad is included, then that makes things very complicated with what should also be included (other tablets, Kindle's, smartphones, computer screen refrigerators etc). It's all very subjective.
A PC isn't defined as a device that allows you do to everything, it's a device that allows you to do everything you want to do. For some people, an iPad meets that definition.
And if all he wants to do is to add, subtract, multiply and divide, then the calculator on his keychain is a PC.
And if he someday wants to calculate a square root? Then it is no longer a PC.
At least, that seems to be what your logic leads to...
I could replace my car with a motorcycle. It does roughly the same job. However, a motorcycle will never be a car. It has different characteristics.
I also suspect that some people are replacing their PC with a smartphone. Again, that doesn't mean that a smartphone is a PC. It has different characteristics.
Bad analogy imo.
By your definition a laptop would not be a personal computer.
If you can classify a POS Dell netbook as a pc, then an iPad def qualifies!
Absolutely! You would not believe the trash I've been migrating data from
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
So we've gone from "the iPad isn't a personal computer because you have to connect it to a Mac/PC running iTunes to activate it" to "iPads aren't personal computers because they can't do as much as Mac OS/Windows"?,<snip>
Actually, my clients and friends that have switched, can actually "do more" than they ever were able to on their "PC". Know why? They're not afraid of the d*** thing!!! To a person, everyone that has switched is afraid to change anything, open anything, surf to their hearts content, whatever. Scared of their email even! Pure fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
After all, the iPad does a lot more and is a lot more powerful than most of the history of "PC"s.
One of the first things I have to show people is that, unlike their old laptop, or teller machines, you only need to "caress" or lightly touch an iPad... or any Apple product.
You should see the way these people bang on the glass, fully expecting the trash experience of their last... uhm... "computer".
Quote:
Originally Posted by JONOROM
Agreed. The term PC has, for many reasons, become increasingly irrelevant.
<snip>
My opinion: if netbooks are included in the total, then tablet computers should be too, as they serve most of the functions of a netbook and are displacing them.
BTW, tablet computer sales always were included in PC sales totals before the iPad came out. Why change now?
When we refer to "PCs" that's a term for a general purpose computer that can have any OS loaded, unrestricted applications and supports all common devices (keyboard, mouse, printer, scanner, monitor, video capture, webcams, pen drives, etc.).
Well it was your list after all....
keyboard: yes
mouse: no need, iPad has a touch interface, right?
printer: yes (wirelessly, to a modern printer)
scanner: built-in camera (BTW, who uses scanners anymore?)
monitor: built-in, and wireless output to TV
video capture: built-in video
webcams: not yet
pen drives: huh?
So the difference is a webcam and a "pen drive?" Funny that you didn't mention an optical drive...
And loading "any" OS, is not something that 99% (that's us!) of buyers want or need. Designing ANY system for the 1% is proving to be a bigtime fail.
Yes, because the entire point of the article is about sales figures based on how the iPad is classified. The same thing happens when you compare Apple to a single other smartphone vendor vs comparing Apple to Android which includes all vendors. If the iPad is included, then that makes things very complicated with what should also be included (other tablets, Kindle's, smartphones, computer screen refrigerators etc). It's all very subjective.
The article said nothing about how the iPad is classified, it was users on this forum started the classification argument.
I thought the article had a way to clear this argument up nicely... "mobile PC"
The article said nothing about how the iPad is classified, it was users on this forum started the classification argument.
I thought the article had a way to clear this argument up nicely... "mobile PC"
1) Calling it a mobile PC is a classification, so the article did classify it.
2) Aren't notebooks mobile PCs, too. I know some are quite large and hard to lug around but they are, by design, mobile with their batteries and collapsing lids.
Classifying any (current)tablet as a computer with it's stripped down OS and reduced functionality is a travesty to the term Personal Computer.
You better give a definition of what you consider Personal Computer. Because the way I look at it, as long as it's for personal use, and it computes, then it's a personal computer.
Classifying any (current)tablet as a computer with it's stripped down OS and reduced functionality is a travesty to the term Personal Computer.
Which era?
The least expensive iPod Touch has many times the capabilities of the personal computers of the 1980-2000 era at a fraction of the cost.
Based on capability, One could say: including a pc in the same category as an iPad is a travesty... there are many things that a pc is just not capable of doing! (and pcs don't run a proper OS or have a proper UI/UX)
Comments
Sounds like a lot of sour grapes to me. The idea that it's not a personal computer unless users can have carte blanche access to delete root files that will brick their machine is a pretty lame excuse. I'd think the term personal would be a big enough clue as to what a personal computer is. After all, the iPad does a lot more and is a lot more powerful than most of the history of "PC"s.
My brain is a computer, is it "personal," too?
Best
Not if you tell us about it.
The argument to this article is if the iPad is a computer?
Who cares, I mean really... is it that big of a deal if and iPad is or is not a computer?
People are getting insulting because they disagree if an iPad is a computer?
Wow....
Seriously
The argument to this article is if the iPad is a computer?
Who cares, I mean really it is that big a deal if and iPad is a computer.
People are getting insulting because they disagree if an iPad is a computer?
Wow....
Oh... I thought that we came here specifically to insult each other.
My brain is a computer, is it "personal," too?
Best
How do you know that your brain is a computer, because perhaps you can think? How many computers think and how many brains compute?
Ultimately, the reason why I think iPads should be included into PC marketshare is because someone- albeit a limited sliver of the market, IS buying the iPad as a PC replacement. That being the case- how can it NOT be included in the same category?
I could replace my car with a motorcycle. It does roughly the same job. However, a motorcycle will never be a car. It has different characteristics.
I also suspect that some people are replacing their PC with a smartphone. Again, that doesn't mean that a smartphone is a PC. It has different characteristics.
So many personal computers are used for transacting email and playing games on and that's it. What makes those systems special in ways that the iPad isn't? In fact, a lot of PC users would benefit greatly by dropping the useless box of Windows junk and going to an iPad instead.
I could reply to at least 6 posts here with the same opinion as above.
Fact: I'm switching over people over from WinXP boxes and assorted laptop trash, to iPad's at almost 1/day.
Fact: every single one of those people are thanking me continuously, and love their "NEW COMPUTER"!
Their words, not mine. So. If the average person on the street: moms, kids, business people (sales mostly), seniors, etc. all call it a "computer", should it not be counted as such?
PS. I must admit, that many people also correct themselves and say, "iPad" after a moment. It must really "P' the geeks off... because you know, outside of America, tablet and slate don't translate well, and similar to "Kleenex" and a "Xerox", iPad is what anything like it, is nominally called.
Deal with it!
The term PC will disappear into yesteryear. It was coined in an age long gone and is a term that, as the iPad has shown, is becoming less and less relevant every day. Hopefully, it will take at least some trolls with it.
Agreed. The term PC has, for many reasons, become increasingly irrelevant.
However, we still have the problem of whether or not we lump tablet computer sales with desktop, laptop and netbook computer sales to come up with a total "personal computer" (NOT Personal Computer") sales figure.
An iPad is much more capable than a PC manufactured in 1999. Should we rename older PCs to no longer be called PCs?
My opinion: if netbooks are included in the total, then tablet computers should be too, as they serve most of the functions of a netbook and are displacing them.
BTW, tablet computer sales always were included in PC sales totals before the iPad came out. Why change now?
Seriously
The argument to this article is if the iPad is a computer?
Who cares, I mean really... is it that big of a deal if and iPad is or is not a computer?
People are getting insulting because they disagree if an iPad is a computer?
Wow....
Yes, because the entire point of the article is about sales figures based on how the iPad is classified. The same thing happens when you compare Apple to a single other smartphone vendor vs comparing Apple to Android which includes all vendors. If the iPad is included, then that makes things very complicated with what should also be included (other tablets, Kindle's, smartphones, computer screen refrigerators etc). It's all very subjective.
A PC isn't defined as a device that allows you do to everything, it's a device that allows you to do everything you want to do. For some people, an iPad meets that definition.
And if all he wants to do is to add, subtract, multiply and divide, then the calculator on his keychain is a PC.
And if he someday wants to calculate a square root? Then it is no longer a PC.
At least, that seems to be what your logic leads to...
I could replace my car with a motorcycle. It does roughly the same job. However, a motorcycle will never be a car. It has different characteristics.
I also suspect that some people are replacing their PC with a smartphone. Again, that doesn't mean that a smartphone is a PC. It has different characteristics.
Bad analogy imo.
By your definition a laptop would not be a personal computer.
Not if you tell us about it.
If you can classify a POS Dell netbook as a pc, then an iPad def qualifies!
Absolutely! You would not believe the trash I've been migrating data from
So we've gone from "the iPad isn't a personal computer because you have to connect it to a Mac/PC running iTunes to activate it" to "iPads aren't personal computers because they can't do as much as Mac OS/Windows"?,<snip>
Actually, my clients and friends that have switched, can actually "do more" than they ever were able to on their "PC". Know why? They're not afraid of the d*** thing!!! To a person, everyone that has switched is afraid to change anything, open anything, surf to their hearts content, whatever. Scared of their email even! Pure fear.
After all, the iPad does a lot more and is a lot more powerful than most of the history of "PC"s.
One of the first things I have to show people is that, unlike their old laptop, or teller machines, you only need to "caress" or lightly touch an iPad... or any Apple product.
You should see the way these people bang on the glass, fully expecting the trash experience of their last... uhm... "computer".
Agreed. The term PC has, for many reasons, become increasingly irrelevant.
<snip>
My opinion: if netbooks are included in the total, then tablet computers should be too, as they serve most of the functions of a netbook and are displacing them.
BTW, tablet computer sales always were included in PC sales totals before the iPad came out. Why change now?
Exactly!
When we refer to "PCs" that's a term for a general purpose computer that can have any OS loaded, unrestricted applications and supports all common devices (keyboard, mouse, printer, scanner, monitor, video capture, webcams, pen drives, etc.).
Well it was your list after all....
keyboard: yes
mouse: no need, iPad has a touch interface, right?
printer: yes (wirelessly, to a modern printer)
scanner: built-in camera (BTW, who uses scanners anymore?)
monitor: built-in, and wireless output to TV
video capture: built-in video
webcams: not yet
pen drives: huh?
So the difference is a webcam and a "pen drive?" Funny that you didn't mention an optical drive...
And loading "any" OS, is not something that 99% (that's us!) of buyers want or need. Designing ANY system for the 1% is proving to be a bigtime fail.
Yes, because the entire point of the article is about sales figures based on how the iPad is classified. The same thing happens when you compare Apple to a single other smartphone vendor vs comparing Apple to Android which includes all vendors. If the iPad is included, then that makes things very complicated with what should also be included (other tablets, Kindle's, smartphones, computer screen refrigerators etc). It's all very subjective.
The article said nothing about how the iPad is classified, it was users on this forum started the classification argument.
I thought the article had a way to clear this argument up nicely... "mobile PC"
The article said nothing about how the iPad is classified, it was users on this forum started the classification argument.
I thought the article had a way to clear this argument up nicely... "mobile PC"
1) Calling it a mobile PC is a classification, so the article did classify it.
2) Aren't notebooks mobile PCs, too. I know some are quite large and hard to lug around but they are, by design, mobile with their batteries and collapsing lids.
"Why is an iPad considered a toy, when the most computational power needed by the PC crowd is for playing games?"
Classifying any (current)tablet as a computer with it's stripped down OS and reduced functionality is a travesty to the term Personal Computer.
You better give a definition of what you consider Personal Computer. Because the way I look at it, as long as it's for personal use, and it computes, then it's a personal computer.
In the other this could be good for the consumer since PC price will keep dropping as Apple collect the PC market share.
To paraphrase a good comment made somewhere the other day:
"Why is an iPad considered a toy, when the most computational power needed by the PC crowd is for playing games?"
I forget which forum member wrote that but I had it in my sig for a couple months.
I think it's said just to disparage the iPad, but those same people will also point out how you can't play "real" games on the iPad either.
You don't see much of that on this forum these days, but go to AnandTech where the homebrew crowd still can't accept Apple in their DIYer world.
Classifying any (current)tablet as a computer with it's stripped down OS and reduced functionality is a travesty to the term Personal Computer.
Which era?
The least expensive iPod Touch has many times the capabilities of the personal computers of the 1980-2000 era at a fraction of the cost.
Based on capability, One could say: including a pc in the same category as an iPad is a travesty... there are many things that a pc is just not capable of doing! (and pcs don't run a proper OS or have a proper UI/UX)