Pitiful! Why not extend it to every person in the world who is, or thinks they have financial problems? If you can't afford the luxuries of life, do without them. This is a great lesson for Greece and everyone who gets into credit card debt.
It has **** all to do with an individual's " financial problems". Outside credit card processing had been blocked, so even a Greek millionaire couldn't renew their iCloud if they wanted to. Next time spent 2 seconds doing some research before shitting on people and on Apple. This was a logical move for Apple to do, if nothing else than for the positive PR and so that people can continue to use their iPhones properly.
Pitiful! Why not extend it to every person in the world who is, or thinks they have financial problems? If you can't afford the luxuries of life, do without them. This is a great lesson for Greece and everyone who gets into credit card debt.
I don't think it has to do with them not having the money to keep their iCloud storage going, but the fact they are physically unable to process a credit card transaction due to the measures the government put in place. This gives the people time to download all of their photos and iCloud documents they have saved so they don't lose them if these controls continue.
The Greek government got their people into the mess they're in, but the Greek people themselves also had a hand in the mistakes. They voted for socialism in response to the failures of socialism. They need to be kicked out of the EU.
85% of them couldn't be bothered to pay taxes either, so...
It has **** all to do with an individual's " financial problems". Outside credit card processing had been blocked, so even a Greek millionaire couldn't renew their iCloud if they wanted to. Next time spent 2 seconds doing some research before shitting on people and on Apple. This was a logical move for Apple to do, if nothing else than for the positive PR and so that people can continue to use their iPhones properly.
Somehow I survive with an iPad and iPhone syncing to 5GB space (the horror). They're going to have to learn to make do without a lot of things.
He voted for that system year after year? How do you know? Did 100% of Greeks vote, and of that 100% voted for the socialist system?
I don't feel bad for the people that voted their leaders in, but I do for the ones who voted against them and are suffering over something they couldn't control (other than cast their vote).
85% not paying taxes. Couple that with corruption at all levels and it's a miracle they've lasted this long.
And people need to stop making the fallacious German comparisons. Greece has not been in a war. Greece has not lost millions of citizens. Greece does not have a bombed out infrastructure. Greece has not lost a significant portion of land to another country. Greece is simply a country that has lived beyond its means for far too long, and is now paying the price.
You forgot to stamp your little feet in self-righteous indignation. Why does everyone who has nothing to lose always demand everything from those who do? Oh yes, I forgot: the "you deserve it" streak that is defining aspect of American society.
Yes, accountability is such a terrible thing. Never mind the fact we give out more foreign aid than any other country on Earth, and spend countless billions on defending countries who've abdicated their responsibilities. Like Greece, for example.
Some of the extreme sentiments expressed here are really shameful. And remarkably ignorant, borderline illiterate.
Yes, Greece messed up. Yes, Greece will probably be better off in the long run outside the Eurozone than in it. (Greece should never have been a part of the Euro to begin with). Yes, in the short run, they'll have to put up with a lot of economic pain regardless of whether they stay or leave. But Greece leaving the Euro will be as much of a problem for the stable countries, as it will be for Greece. It will shred the credibility of the European Union. That's the reason that this has dragged on for so long.
Lenders are not blameless. They lent money knowing there's default risk. Bankruptcy is an inherent part of capitalism (as someone once said, 'capitalism without bankruptcy is like religion without sin'), and if you choose to be a lender, that's the risk you take.
However, a country can't declare bankruptcy unlike an individual or a company can. The only solution to this is debt restructuring, as has happened repeatedly in the past, for many countries around the world. For example, Germany could not have become the post-war economic power that it became if its debts had not been written down by creditors, and people (especially the U.S.) gave it a lot of aid under the Marshall Plan. Similarly for Brazil and Mexico in the 1980s, where debt had to be restructured. The list of counties that have done this is quite large, and I could go on with many examples.
Restructuring means any or all of three things: write down the face value, lengthen the maturity, and/or lower the interest rate. This will be combined with fairly harsh austerity measures (e.g., raising taxes, cutting pensions, cutting government spending). It will happen in some form or the other. It's inevitable. Period. But dragging it on the way it has been serves absolutely no purpose other than to create unnecessary uncertainty in the global economy, and impact stock markets around the world.
Let me put it this way: if Greece is kicked out of the Euro, as some of you are rooting for, it will take a toll on the stock and bond markets, i.e. our wealth, here.
The only thing mature adults should be rooting for is a fast resolution of the problem with a quick debt restructuring. Anything else is kabuki.
Excellent post sir. All valid points, including your opening statement. And thanks for having me looking up kabuki.
I have no sympathy for Greece or it's people. I don't understand the posts of people who stick up for Greece. Greece dug themselves in their own hole and never had any real plan to pay back it's debt or make it's current financial issues better. This is a country where people retire in their 40's and get overly generous pensions. Greece pays the most towards pensions out of any EU country. I don't blame countries like Finland, Sweden, and others who are sick of paying for Greeks who chose to retire in their 40's. Greece has been paying billions for all these ridiculous bonuses for things such as arriving to work on time, using a computer, etc. Greece has all these so called government committees that do absolutely nothing. To top it off, the rampant tax evasion by Greek businesses and citizens is costing a fortune since the government won't do anything about it. There is no point giving Greece more bailout money. Giving more money to the Greeks is just putting a bandaid on a wound that needs surgery. They need to get booted from the eurozone ASAP.
This has nothing to do with individual citizens financial problems or credit card debt, they literally are not allowed to send money out of country. The banks are denying all credit cards and other payments. If they were millionaires they couldn't renew their iCloud accounts.
Absolutely. I am amazed at the degree of ignorance and hate (they often go together..) transpiring in most comments here. Whether you have money or not in Greece today, you CANNOT pay. End of story.
He voted for that system year after year? How do you know? Did 100% of Greeks vote, and of that 100% voted for the socialist system?
I don't feel bad for the people that voted their leaders in, but I do for the ones who voted against them and are suffering over something they couldn't control (other than cast their vote).
Have you never heard of the phrase that goes "attack the argument, not the poster?". You should educate yourself, because you are clearly ignorant as to its' existence.
An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"[1]), short for argumentum ad hominem, means responding to arguments by attacking a person's character, rather than to the content of their arguments. When used inappropriately, it is a fallacy in which a claim or argument is dismissed on the basis of some irrelevant fact or supposition about the author or the person being criticized.
This is not a leftist dictatorship, and you will just have to accept that there are people out there that have differing viewpoints and opinions than you might have. If you don't like that or if you can not accept that, then you should go elsewhere.
Your post has been reported for violation of AI forum rule #1.
They need to get booted from the eurozone ASAP. #Grexit
I think that most of greek people want to leave EU, but ECB (that is a private bank, not subject to EU control) does not allow until debt is repaid. This is, in my opinion, the root of all problems.
With all due respect that's Completely and utterly wrong. The ECB is not at all a private bank, and all polls show the vast majority of Greeks don't want to leave the EU or for that matter the euro. It would be easy if they did, but the whole problem is that they don't!
God, does everybody on here just read apple blog all day long ? Embarrassing.
I think that most of greek people want to leave EU, but ECB (that is a private bank, not subject to EU control) does not allow until debt is repaid. This is, in my opinion, the root of all problems.
its amazing what you can find out with search engines like google
Indeed, isn't it just!
P.S. I note the article has quietly been updated to reflect what I wrote earlier. Does AI not have editorial policies to make changes clear to their readers?
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdowell
"As a byproduct of Greece's recent vote for austerity,.."
Wow. Some tech writers really haven't a bloody clue.
Pitiful! Why not extend it to every person in the world who is, or thinks they have financial problems? If you can't afford the luxuries of life, do without them. This is a great lesson for Greece and everyone who gets into credit card debt.
My history of the era isn't too good but didn't Greece vote along with other countries to allow Germany's debit to be written off after WWII? This after Greece was brutalized beyond belief by the Germans too. Somewhat of a worse offense than 'having financial problems' when you think about it.
That along with Marshall Plan, $120 Billion in today's money, from the USA got Germany going again. Sometimes helping out works quite well in the long run. If not for those actions of help, Germany would be an impoverished nation probably begging for a hand out today. That or they'd have started WWIII by now.
And it's no surprise and no coincidence that other countries that are also socialist failures have been praising Greece for their stupidity, such as Argentina.
This crisis has nothing to do with socialism and everything to do with predatory capitalism.
Yes, accountability is such a terrible thing. Never mind the fact we give out more foreign aid than any other country on Earth, and spend countless billions on defending countries who've abdicated their responsibilities. Like Greece, for example.
Just for the record: The problem with looking at the total numbers like that is that it doesn’t take into account the relative sizes of the economies and populations, to judge if the US is the biggest donor, we have to take into account how large a part of the GNP per capita goes to foreign aid, If we do the USA is behind Greece ironically.
Comments
It has **** all to do with an individual's " financial problems". Outside credit card processing had been blocked, so even a Greek millionaire couldn't renew their iCloud if they wanted to. Next time spent 2 seconds doing some research before shitting on people and on Apple. This was a logical move for Apple to do, if nothing else than for the positive PR and so that people can continue to use their iPhones properly.
I don't think it has to do with them not having the money to keep their iCloud storage going, but the fact they are physically unable to process a credit card transaction due to the measures the government put in place. This gives the people time to download all of their photos and iCloud documents they have saved so they don't lose them if these controls continue.
85% of them couldn't be bothered to pay taxes either, so...
Somehow I survive with an iPad and iPhone syncing to 5GB space (the horror). They're going to have to learn to make do without a lot of things.
85% not paying taxes. Couple that with corruption at all levels and it's a miracle they've lasted this long.
And people need to stop making the fallacious German comparisons. Greece has not been in a war. Greece has not lost millions of citizens. Greece does not have a bombed out infrastructure. Greece has not lost a significant portion of land to another country. Greece is simply a country that has lived beyond its means for far too long, and is now paying the price.
You forgot to stamp your little feet in self-righteous indignation. Why does everyone who has nothing to lose always demand everything from those who do? Oh yes, I forgot: the "you deserve it" streak that is defining aspect of American society.
Yes, accountability is such a terrible thing. Never mind the fact we give out more foreign aid than any other country on Earth, and spend countless billions on defending countries who've abdicated their responsibilities. Like Greece, for example.
Excellent post sir. All valid points, including your opening statement. And thanks for having me looking up kabuki.
I have no sympathy for Greece or it's people. I don't understand the posts of people who stick up for Greece. Greece dug themselves in their own hole and never had any real plan to pay back it's debt or make it's current financial issues better. This is a country where people retire in their 40's and get overly generous pensions. Greece pays the most towards pensions out of any EU country. I don't blame countries like Finland, Sweden, and others who are sick of paying for Greeks who chose to retire in their 40's. Greece has been paying billions for all these ridiculous bonuses for things such as arriving to work on time, using a computer, etc. Greece has all these so called government committees that do absolutely nothing. To top it off, the rampant tax evasion by Greek businesses and citizens is costing a fortune since the government won't do anything about it. There is no point giving Greece more bailout money. Giving more money to the Greeks is just putting a bandaid on a wound that needs surgery. They need to get booted from the eurozone ASAP.
#Grexit
Wow. Some tech writers really haven't a bloody clue.
This has nothing to do with individual citizens financial problems or credit card debt, they literally are not allowed to send money out of country. The banks are denying all credit cards and other payments. If they were millionaires they couldn't renew their iCloud accounts.
Absolutely. I am amazed at the degree of ignorance and hate (they often go together..) transpiring in most comments here. Whether you have money or not in Greece today, you CANNOT pay. End of story.
This is the problem with Democratic Socialism.
Three if you include Apple ][.
He's not the smartest of the bunch. I guess we could excuse him for that, were it not that he suffers from xenophobia. And misogyny. And misandry.
For some, a reason not to visit this site. Or simply block Apple ][ and skip over replies addressed to him, where he gets quoted.
You are guilty.
AI Guidelines:
1. No personal attacks on members of AI.
http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/143315/guidelines
Have you never heard of the phrase that goes "attack the argument, not the poster?". You should educate yourself, because you are clearly ignorant as to its' existence.
An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"[1]), short for argumentum ad hominem, means responding to arguments by attacking a person's character, rather than to the content of their arguments. When used inappropriately, it is a fallacy in which a claim or argument is dismissed on the basis of some irrelevant fact or supposition about the author or the person being criticized.
This is not a leftist dictatorship, and you will just have to accept that there are people out there that have differing viewpoints and opinions than you might have. If you don't like that or if you can not accept that, then you should go elsewhere.
Your post has been reported for violation of AI forum rule #1.
I think that most of greek people want to leave EU, but ECB (that is a private bank, not subject to EU control) does not allow until debt is repaid. This is, in my opinion, the root of all problems.
God, does everybody on here just read apple blog all day long ? Embarrassing.
I think that most of greek people want to leave EU, but ECB (that is a private bank, not subject to EU control) does not allow until debt is repaid. This is, in my opinion, the root of all problems.
its amazing what you can find out with search engines like google
its amazing what you can find out with search engines like google
Indeed, isn't it just!
P.S. I note the article has quietly been updated to reflect what I wrote earlier. Does AI not have editorial policies to make changes clear to their readers?
"As a byproduct of Greece's recent vote for austerity,.."
Wow. Some tech writers really haven't a bloody clue.
My history of the era isn't too good but didn't Greece vote along with other countries to allow Germany's debit to be written off after WWII? This after Greece was brutalized beyond belief by the Germans too. Somewhat of a worse offense than 'having financial problems' when you think about it.
That along with Marshall Plan, $120 Billion in today's money, from the USA got Germany going again. Sometimes helping out works quite well in the long run. If not for those actions of help, Germany would be an impoverished nation probably begging for a hand out today. That or they'd have started WWIII by now.
Until it is something that messes their lives up.
Just for the record: The problem with looking at the total numbers like that is that it doesn’t take into account the relative sizes of the economies and populations, to judge if the US is the biggest donor, we have to take into account how large a part of the GNP per capita goes to foreign aid, If we do the USA is behind Greece ironically.
To be fair, it seems to be a bit of both in this case.