I agree mostly. However, I don't believe they will release 3ghz at WWDC... unless they postpone shipping until fall.
There are a lot of problems with the current line. They can not (from a business standpoint) last until the minimum of July (WWDC). Not only are they having hte problems listed above.. they are also having motherboard problems. Aren't they on Rev E powersupply's now?
The XServes are more powerful then the PowerMacs right now... how can that be good for any company? A server being faster then the Professional line?
Any ways... I'm really starting to doubt myself at this point. Today I spent 2 hours browsing for a used PowerMac g4 so I could get back on OS X. Seems like it will never happen now. It really sucks because I have a 20% off discount off of apple hardware waiting for me too.
I've heard about some problems, e.g. the powersupply, but I have no impression of this being a major problem...
And what about the opening of the SF Applestore: http://www.apple.com/retail/sanfrancisco/ Feb 28th. They won't open a store full of 1.6, 1.8 and 2GHz Power Macs and then release new models the next tuesday... There goes my March 2nd prediction
I've heard about some problems, e.g. the powersupply, but I have no impression of this being a major problem...
Yah I never said it was a major issue... but it took apple a long time to nail down the problem. I believe they are fixed now. But like I said... I heard Rev E... My best friend is an Apple Repair tech at an ESD. He has already had to replace about 10 motherboards in DUAL g5s... The singles have been fine. Apple has acknowledged to the techs about this. Therefore, no url. They claim they have come up with a fix for this.
Yah I never said it was a major issue... but it took apple a long time to nail down the problem. I believe they are fixed now. But like I said... I heard Rev E... My best friend is an Apple Repair tech at an ESD. He has already had to replace about 10 motherboards in DUAL g5s... The singles have been fine. Apple has acknowledged to the techs about this. Therefore, no url. They claim they have come up with a fix for this.
Well if it's fixed where is the problem? Not everything comes out perfect especially off an assembly line, but once the problem is identified, repairs are made, and defective units are taken care of your problem is over. It sounds to me like this problem was over before it even became a big stink because few of us even knew about it.
Well if it's fixed where is the problem? Not everything comes out perfect especially off an assembly line, but once the problem is identified, repairs are made, and defective units are taken care of your problem is over. It sounds to me like this problem was over before it even became a big stink because few of us even knew about it.
You're right...
My original point was (I dont' think I was clear on this) this was the reason I didn't want to buy a Rev A g5. The odds were there were going to be problems with these machines. I didn't want to deal with it. Now they have been refined and have been fixed. The Rev B's are less likely to have as many problems with them. I didn't want to deal with these problems. Also just because they are fixed doesn't mean that there are some g5's in stock at some stores that contain the old parts. These users are still likely to witness problems with the Rev A machines.
Of course all of these machines will be under warranty and the newer parts will be installed. But its a hassle...
There are no iBooks either. While it is interesting that they don't show Power Macs at all, I think the reason is that they chose to not disturb the harmonic disposition of AIOs (Powerbooks, eMacs, iMacs) with 2-part machines. I don't see other than aesthetic reasons.
Waiting for a better machine is all well in good but there is a question as to how much of a rev the rev"B"s will be. If Apple revs the machines enough you could very well be starting all over with the bug / fix cycles.
For example if the Rev Bs have PCI-Express in place of the AGP port that will be a major change. If they switch memory technologies it will be a major change. If Apples goal is to scale the machines then there are a number of considerations that they have to deal with. There is no reason to expect that the Rev Bs will be that much more stable in the begining.
Dave
Quote:
Originally posted by emig647
You're right...
My original point was (I dont' think I was clear on this) this was the reason I didn't want to buy a Rev A g5. The odds were there were going to be problems with these machines. I didn't want to deal with it. Now they have been refined and have been fixed. The Rev B's are less likely to have as many problems with them. I didn't want to deal with these problems. Also just because they are fixed doesn't mean that there are some g5's in stock at some stores that contain the old parts. These users are still likely to witness problems with the Rev A machines.
Of course all of these machines will be under warranty and the newer parts will be installed. But its a hassle...
Waiting for a better machine is all well in good but there is a question as to how much of a rev the rev"B"s will be. If Apple revs the machines enough you could very well be starting all over with the bug / fix cycles.
For example if the Rev Bs have PCI-Express in place of the AGP port that will be a major change. If they switch memory technologies it will be a major change. If Apples goal is to scale the machines then there are a number of considerations that they have to deal with. There is no reason to expect that the Rev Bs will be that much more stable in the begining.
Dave
Sure there is... the Rev A g5's had brand new processors brand new mobos, brand new everything.. these will only have minor changes. rev b's will have the same technologies that have been tested over the last 6/7 months. This gave everybody a chance to see how they would handle in the real world. But you are right the rev b's probably won't have much change. Therefore, they should be sturdy! Don't hold me to my word, it's a computer. 8)
Good luck clearing those quantities of G5's... if people have waited this long they are going to wait for the updates. Anyone who buys a g5 right now is out of their mind. I would assume power mac sales are way down right now. I'm too lazy to find a url right now. I just don't see how they could keep up those sales. \
Then why would anyone ever buy anything? There is always going to be a faster machine coming down the pipeline. The g5s were a huge speed improvement over the G4s - now moving from 2.0Ghz to 2.5 - is that really going to change things all that much? Probably not unless you are crunching huge databases or doing media work. Even then it is not going to be that huge a deal.
Plenty of people don't ever visit this forum and have no idea that new machines are on their way - I would say that the machines are moving fine but that is just a guess - if they aren't, then I would hypothesize that speed has nothing to do with it...
Most people don't visit these forums, but most people also don't make a $2000 - $3,000+ computer investment without doing a little homework.
In addition, most APPLE Pro users or others attracted to these machines are well aware of how long they have been on the market and what they are buying.
This points back to the need of having regular dependable, predictable speed bumps so people will buy with out worrying about the next big bump.
For example I've been waiting to buy 2 G5's. Now I'm a bit apprehensive because PCI-Express may be coming out. If I wait much longer then well maybe the 975 will be just around the corner, etc.
The point is that while there are always technological advances, if the rev2's had already been out I would have already purchased 2 of them. Now, however, since I've waited so long there is another technology jump with PCI-Express and DDR-2 right around the corner....
If you look back to the original iMac, it seemed like every three to five months they had a bump in specs of some sort. This is part of the reason they did so well. Apple needs to get back on this path.
If you look back to the original iMac, it seemed like every three to five months they had a bump in specs of some sort. This is part of the reason they did so well. Apple needs to get back on this path.
Agreed, Like i've mentioned before... I get sicker to the stomach the longer apple waits. THe guy I sold my g4 to brought it here to be worked on today, I wanted to grab it and go running!
I don't see how putting off updates is beneficial to company or consumer.
I don't see how putting off updates is beneficial to company or consumer.
It is beneficial because things are not ready (or have not been tested enough) create massive problems for Apple and every other company. Throwing things out there because there is demand has to be weighed against the possibility of putting out an item that has a major issue after prolonged use (ibook logic board, PB 5300, TiBook white spots, G4 noise and G5 power supply/heat problems, powerbook case warpage) And those problems just listed were probably things that AAPL was willing to take the risk on to deliver things... none of them were major failures. Recalls and after-sale fixes, not to mention class action suits, really screw the margin on a machine. Dell can fudge. Apple can't.
It is certainly not beneficial to the consumer, because we have to wait. But I would rather wait an extra month or two, rather than have to haul my Mac in for service because something slipped by.
It is beneficial because things are not ready (or have not been tested enough) create massive problems for Apple and every other company. Throwing things out there because there is demand has to be weighed against the possibility of putting out an item that has a major issue after prolonged use (ibook logic board, PB 5300, TiBook white spots, G4 noise and G5 power supply/heat problems, powerbook case warpage) And those problems just listed were probably things that AAPL was willing to take the risk on to deliver things... none of them were major failures. Recalls and after-sale fixes, not to mention class action suits, really screw the margin on a machine. Dell can fudge. Apple can't.
It is certainly not beneficial to the consumer, because we have to wait. But I would rather wait an extra month or two, rather than have to haul my Mac in for service because something slipped by.
Comments
Originally posted by emig647
I agree mostly. However, I don't believe they will release 3ghz at WWDC... unless they postpone shipping until fall.
There are a lot of problems with the current line. They can not (from a business standpoint) last until the minimum of July (WWDC). Not only are they having hte problems listed above.. they are also having motherboard problems. Aren't they on Rev E powersupply's now?
The XServes are more powerful then the PowerMacs right now... how can that be good for any company? A server being faster then the Professional line?
Any ways... I'm really starting to doubt myself at this point. Today I spent 2 hours browsing for a used PowerMac g4 so I could get back on OS X. Seems like it will never happen now. It really sucks because I have a 20% off discount off of apple hardware waiting for me too.
I've heard about some problems, e.g. the powersupply, but I have no impression of this being a major problem...
Originally posted by sls
I've heard about some problems, e.g. the powersupply, but I have no impression of this being a major problem...
Yah I never said it was a major issue... but it took apple a long time to nail down the problem. I believe they are fixed now. But like I said... I heard Rev E... My best friend is an Apple Repair tech at an ESD. He has already had to replace about 10 motherboards in DUAL g5s... The singles have been fine. Apple has acknowledged to the techs about this. Therefore, no url. They claim they have come up with a fix for this.
Originally posted by emig647
Yah I never said it was a major issue... but it took apple a long time to nail down the problem. I believe they are fixed now. But like I said... I heard Rev E... My best friend is an Apple Repair tech at an ESD. He has already had to replace about 10 motherboards in DUAL g5s... The singles have been fine. Apple has acknowledged to the techs about this. Therefore, no url. They claim they have come up with a fix for this.
Well if it's fixed where is the problem? Not everything comes out perfect especially off an assembly line, but once the problem is identified, repairs are made, and defective units are taken care of your problem is over. It sounds to me like this problem was over before it even became a big stink because few of us even knew about it.
Originally posted by onlooker
Well if it's fixed where is the problem? Not everything comes out perfect especially off an assembly line, but once the problem is identified, repairs are made, and defective units are taken care of your problem is over. It sounds to me like this problem was over before it even became a big stink because few of us even knew about it.
You're right...
My original point was (I dont' think I was clear on this) this was the reason I didn't want to buy a Rev A g5. The odds were there were going to be problems with these machines. I didn't want to deal with it. Now they have been refined and have been fixed. The Rev B's are less likely to have as many problems with them. I didn't want to deal with these problems. Also just because they are fixed doesn't mean that there are some g5's in stock at some stores that contain the old parts. These users are still likely to witness problems with the Rev A machines.
Of course all of these machines will be under warranty and the newer parts will be installed. But its a hassle...
where are they hiding the PM G5s?
Originally posted by sls
http://www.apple.com/retail/sanfrancisco/gallery.html
where are they hiding the PM G5s?
There are no iBooks either. While it is interesting that they don't show Power Macs at all, I think the reason is that they chose to not disturb the harmonic disposition of AIOs (Powerbooks, eMacs, iMacs) with 2-part machines. I don't see other than aesthetic reasons.
But then again, where are the iBooks
Originally posted by fieldor
No PM untill March, that's like 3-4 days away.8)
And then we probably have to wait 30 days in March for new.. something.
Sheesh. Let's get these things out already.
For example if the Rev Bs have PCI-Express in place of the AGP port that will be a major change. If they switch memory technologies it will be a major change. If Apples goal is to scale the machines then there are a number of considerations that they have to deal with. There is no reason to expect that the Rev Bs will be that much more stable in the begining.
Dave
Originally posted by emig647
You're right...
My original point was (I dont' think I was clear on this) this was the reason I didn't want to buy a Rev A g5. The odds were there were going to be problems with these machines. I didn't want to deal with it. Now they have been refined and have been fixed. The Rev B's are less likely to have as many problems with them. I didn't want to deal with these problems. Also just because they are fixed doesn't mean that there are some g5's in stock at some stores that contain the old parts. These users are still likely to witness problems with the Rev A machines.
Of course all of these machines will be under warranty and the newer parts will be installed. But its a hassle...
Originally posted by wizard69
Waiting for a better machine is all well in good but there is a question as to how much of a rev the rev"B"s will be. If Apple revs the machines enough you could very well be starting all over with the bug / fix cycles.
For example if the Rev Bs have PCI-Express in place of the AGP port that will be a major change. If they switch memory technologies it will be a major change. If Apples goal is to scale the machines then there are a number of considerations that they have to deal with. There is no reason to expect that the Rev Bs will be that much more stable in the begining.
Dave
Sure there is... the Rev A g5's had brand new processors brand new mobos, brand new everything.. these will only have minor changes. rev b's will have the same technologies that have been tested over the last 6/7 months. This gave everybody a chance to see how they would handle in the real world. But you are right the rev b's probably won't have much change. Therefore, they should be sturdy! Don't hold me to my word, it's a computer. 8)
Originally posted by emig647
Good luck clearing those quantities of G5's... if people have waited this long they are going to wait for the updates. Anyone who buys a g5 right now is out of their mind. I would assume power mac sales are way down right now. I'm too lazy to find a url right now. I just don't see how they could keep up those sales.
Then why would anyone ever buy anything? There is always going to be a faster machine coming down the pipeline. The g5s were a huge speed improvement over the G4s - now moving from 2.0Ghz to 2.5 - is that really going to change things all that much? Probably not unless you are crunching huge databases or doing media work. Even then it is not going to be that huge a deal.
Plenty of people don't ever visit this forum and have no idea that new machines are on their way - I would say that the machines are moving fine but that is just a guess - if they aren't, then I would hypothesize that speed has nothing to do with it...
In addition, most APPLE Pro users or others attracted to these machines are well aware of how long they have been on the market and what they are buying.
This points back to the need of having regular dependable, predictable speed bumps so people will buy with out worrying about the next big bump.
For example I've been waiting to buy 2 G5's. Now I'm a bit apprehensive because PCI-Express may be coming out. If I wait much longer then well maybe the 975 will be just around the corner, etc.
The point is that while there are always technological advances, if the rev2's had already been out I would have already purchased 2 of them. Now, however, since I've waited so long there is another technology jump with PCI-Express and DDR-2 right around the corner....
Not the ideal marketing method IMHO.
Originally posted by oldmacfan
If you look back to the original iMac, it seemed like every three to five months they had a bump in specs of some sort. This is part of the reason they did so well. Apple needs to get back on this path.
Agreed, Like i've mentioned before... I get sicker to the stomach the longer apple waits. THe guy I sold my g4 to brought it here to be worked on today, I wanted to grab it and go running!
I don't see how putting off updates is beneficial to company or consumer.
Originally posted by emig647
I don't see how putting off updates is beneficial to company or consumer.
It is beneficial because things are not ready (or have not been tested enough) create massive problems for Apple and every other company. Throwing things out there because there is demand has to be weighed against the possibility of putting out an item that has a major issue after prolonged use (ibook logic board, PB 5300, TiBook white spots, G4 noise and G5 power supply/heat problems, powerbook case warpage) And those problems just listed were probably things that AAPL was willing to take the risk on to deliver things... none of them were major failures. Recalls and after-sale fixes, not to mention class action suits, really screw the margin on a machine. Dell can fudge. Apple can't.
It is certainly not beneficial to the consumer, because we have to wait. But I would rather wait an extra month or two, rather than have to haul my Mac in for service because something slipped by.
Originally posted by Jubelum
It is beneficial because things are not ready (or have not been tested enough) create massive problems for Apple and every other company. Throwing things out there because there is demand has to be weighed against the possibility of putting out an item that has a major issue after prolonged use (ibook logic board, PB 5300, TiBook white spots, G4 noise and G5 power supply/heat problems, powerbook case warpage) And those problems just listed were probably things that AAPL was willing to take the risk on to deliver things... none of them were major failures. Recalls and after-sale fixes, not to mention class action suits, really screw the margin on a machine. Dell can fudge. Apple can't.
It is certainly not beneficial to the consumer, because we have to wait. But I would rather wait an extra month or two, rather than have to haul my Mac in for service because something slipped by.
To put it simply... You're right.