Review: macOS Catalina 10.15 is what Apple promised the Mac could be, and is a crucial upg...

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  • Reply 21 of 168
    ednl said:
    Not all 32-bit software is ancient. I use Lightroom 6 standalone and have no alternative lined up yet, certainly not the subscription.
    Adobe is still shipping parts of the CS suite that is 32bit.
    until that is fixed this release is a total NO-GO Zone for a huge number of people.

    They (Adobe) are not alone in that.

    I'll try it on an old laptop just to see what happens to my 38Gb iTunes library but there is no way that this is going anywhere near my main systems for at least 3 months.
    ElCapitanbaconstang
  • Reply 22 of 168
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 5,962member
    It's actually a shame how negative people are about this new OS.  I'm excited about it and fortunately, I have a MBP that sees minimal use so I will use that as my test machine to make sure all is well before I upgrade my two main workstations.

    I don't recall which bad OS release experience I had (I think it was Lion), but even then it's not like it crippled my machine.  Whatever it was, it got fixed and I moved on with minimal whine.  Certainly not the level that people here are having hissy-fits over.

    No one is putting a pistol to your head and forcing you to upgrade on day one.  You can easily wait to do it for a month or two.  If Catalina is as bad as many of you sofa-critics are saying, then don't upgrade at all.  Realize that there are more important things in life to dwell on than an OS release.  You're more than welcome to go to Windows or Linux and see how well that works for you.

    I'm happy that Apple does this as they do.  I'm sure there will be hiccups.  No OS is perfect.  Heck, I've griped about things that Apple did wrong, but they eventually got resolved and usually made even better.

    Just go away.
    StrangeDayslolliverMissNomerwatto_cobra
  • Reply 23 of 168
    dougddougd Posts: 292member
    I can only assume you're being an A-Hole
    dougd said:
    I wouldn't touch it for at least six months after the disastrous IOS 13 rollout
    Dougd doesn’t like it!

    Dont know what I’m doing wrong, but I’ve encountered zero disaster here. Can you clarify further about how you’ve been victimized by Apple? What are the real-world limitations you’ve experienced as part of the “disaster” on your end? Inquiring minds want to know. 

  • Reply 24 of 168
    AppleishAppleish Posts: 459member
    I can't believe you STILL can't put Apple created playlists in folders. Ugh... I have a couple of hundred playlists or so in one unwieldy long list in the sidebar of iTunes, now Music.
  • Reply 25 of 168
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    ElCapitan said:
    ElCapitan said:

    elijahg said:
    Bloody hell is DED trying to break the world record on longest article? Catalina really doesn’t add enough for what’s taken away for me, namely 32 bit application support. Seems a bit ridiculous to eliminated 32 bit support entirely. 32 bit apps can be sandboxed for security and 32 bit libraries can stay linked but unloaded until they’re required, so the extra RAM usage and security is a non-issue. 
    Christ, they’ve deprecated and announced the planned end of life for 32-bit apps years ago, and yet people are still gonna get butthurt and whine about it when it finally happens. 

    No man, it’s not ridiculous. It streamlines the OS, the future processors, and is the direction the future is moving. Move past the denial stage and accept it. 
    Let the migration to other platforms begin.  Am in the process of moving a lot of solutions that ran brilliantly on Apple kit to Linux as it is no longer viable for macOS. 
    Awesome. Guess that means we won’t have the constant butthurt to look forward to in the near future? Have fun playing the drivers game on Linux, the bastion of easy computing...lol
    You sound as idiotic as always. Get yourself pulled out of the Apple Stockholm syndrome you're locked into. 
    Having 30 years of NeXT/Apple OS X and 20 years of Linux the ABI broken model that is Linux is one of the most crippling aspects of the platform, never mind the UX which has taken basically everything Apple HIG develops and slowly adopted it within GNOME. KDE is a swiss cheese approach to everything is modifiable and slow as molasses on the desktop.

    Linux has focused primarily on the server space in order to stay feasible and it came with billions invested by IBM, Oracle, RedHat [now owned by IBM], Cisco, Qualcomm, Google, etc.

    After nearly 30 years of development it is still a constantly broken [it's our philosophy update often] platform. It is the reason the Long Term versions of a few select distributions have been picked and supported by AMD, Intel, ARM, IBM, etc. With roughly 3 major kernel releases per year the typical Professional Linux distribution is 2 to 3 years old.

    Apple will never port their Frameworks to third parties. I recall being interviewed by Real Networks and ultimately finding out they hoped I would give them a shortcut into Apple's plans for QuickTime as they wanted to buy it. Real Networks never was too bright.

    During the early merger days I'll never forget the shit storm when Linus arrived at Apple Engineering and overreached his importance when he was interviewed to become a member of the Kernel team.

    He wasn't the only person in the industry who has interviewed over the years with Apple to be irritated that he really wasn't going to have the same ``influence'' he did before interviewing. I guess people really don't research Apple before interviewing because when you arrive you discover it's a hive of the top minds the world has to offer. Back on topic.

    32 bit deprecation and Linux


    Linux is deprecating and nearly completely deprecated 32 bit apps itself. Debian, Ubuntu and RedHat have all deprecated them. When Debian says goodbye very soon that will include Ubuntu and many other ``Debian derived distributions'' who survive solely because of the hard work by the talented folks that make Debian continue to sustain itself.

    Steam will soon move to 64 bit only. That should end the whining on 32 bit. Adobe dumped 32 bit quite a while ago. Hell, they dropped it in Photoshop back in 2012. Move on or become obsolete.
    StrangeDayscat52macplusplusdewmelollivermacxpressphilboogieMissNomerwatto_cobra
  • Reply 26 of 168
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    cornchip said:

    dougd said:
    I wouldn't touch it for at least six months after the disastrous IOS 13 rollout
    Dougd doesn’t like it!

    Dont know what I’m doing wrong, but I’ve encountered zero disaster here. Can you clarify further about how you’ve been victimized by Apple? What are the real-world limitations you’ve experienced as part of the “disaster” on your end? Inquiring minds want to know. 
    Seriously. iOS 13 is chock full of really nice little details & upgrades with virtually zero bugs...

    DISASTER!!! 
    Catalina's entire Device Driver architecture is brand new and folks around here have no clue that is but one of hundreds of changes for the better.
    StrangeDayscat52macpluspluslollivermacxpresswatto_cobra
  • Reply 27 of 168
    rezwitsrezwits Posts: 818member
    Come on HomePod update 13, and we are HomeFree!!
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 28 of 168
    Dan_DilgerDan_Dilger Posts: 1,583member
    ednl said:
    Not all 32-bit software is ancient. I use Lightroom 6 standalone and have no alternative lined up yet, certainly not the subscription.
    Lightroom 6 is a 64 bit app. Does it show up as 32-bit in your system report? It does cause warnings in Mojave, but this may be due to other linked software it shipped with.
    lolliverwatto_cobra
  • Reply 29 of 168
    Dan_DilgerDan_Dilger Posts: 1,583member
    crowley said:
    Not sure which part was supposed to be crucial?

    I may install it on a partition when I have some time to kill, but ditching 32-bit apps... that's a tough pill to build up to, it'll take a while.
    What 32 bit apps do you use? 
    Soliwatto_cobra
  • Reply 30 of 168
    dougd said:
    I wouldn't touch it for at least six months after the disastrous IOS 13 rollout
    lol. I see what you did there.  Made a declaration about something and offered no back up.  Then we're supposed to say, "dougd said IOS 13 was a disaster, so IT MUST BE TRUE!". Fail.

    Running smoothly here.  No issues.  Not only that. A cursory look at news about said IOS shows not a lot of noise about a "disastrous" rollout.

    Whatever dude.
    StrangeDayscat52fastasleeplolliverwatto_cobra
  • Reply 31 of 168
    Dan_DilgerDan_Dilger Posts: 1,583member
    drickey said:
    Contrary to the first image, Catalina is WEST of Los Angeles, not East
    It certainly is west of LA. The map is oriented so that south is up, to match the image of Catalina that Apple uses as the desktop image, taken from the NW and looking "up" towards the south
    fastasleeplolliverleehammwatto_cobra
  • Reply 32 of 168
    Dan_DilgerDan_Dilger Posts: 1,583member
    elijahg said:
    Bloody hell is DED trying to break the world record on longest article? Catalina really doesn’t add enough for what’s taken away for me, namely 32 bit application support. Seems a bit ridiculous to eliminated 32 bit support entirely. 32 bit apps can be sandboxed for security and 32 bit libraries can stay linked but unloaded until they’re required, so the extra RAM usage and security is a non-issue. 
    What 32 bit apps are you using?
    Solilolliverdrice4444watto_cobra
  • Reply 33 of 168
    ElCapitan said:
    ElCapitan said:

    elijahg said:
    Bloody hell is DED trying to break the world record on longest article? Catalina really doesn’t add enough for what’s taken away for me, namely 32 bit application support. Seems a bit ridiculous to eliminated 32 bit support entirely. 32 bit apps can be sandboxed for security and 32 bit libraries can stay linked but unloaded until they’re required, so the extra RAM usage and security is a non-issue. 
    Christ, they’ve deprecated and announced the planned end of life for 32-bit apps years ago, and yet people are still gonna get butthurt and whine about it when it finally happens. 

    No man, it’s not ridiculous. It streamlines the OS, the future processors, and is the direction the future is moving. Move past the denial stage and accept it. 
    Let the migration to other platforms begin.  Am in the process of moving a lot of solutions that ran brilliantly on Apple kit to Linux as it is no longer viable for macOS. 
    Awesome. Guess that means we won’t have the constant butthurt to look forward to in the near future? Have fun playing the drivers game on Linux, the bastion of easy computing...lol
    You sound as idiotic as always. Get yourself pulled out of the Apple Stockholm syndrome you're locked into. 
    ... That should end the whining on 32 bit.
    Not whining about the end of 32 bit. That is long overdue. 

    There are other aspects like Unix 3 never being updated, deprecation of OpenGL and no longer offering backend solutions for small businesses that cause, and will accelerating cause, a number of solutions being out of reach for macOS users, forcing a migration to other operating systems. The Mac ecosystem is now broken.
  • Reply 34 of 168
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 5,962member
    drickey said:
    Contrary to the first image, Catalina is WEST of Los Angeles, not East
    It certainly is west of LA. The map is oriented so that south is up, to match the image of Catalina that Apple uses as the desktop image, taken from the NW and looking "up" towards the south
    That map being upside down was bugging the heck out of me too... wonder why they did it that way?
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 168
    Dan_DilgerDan_Dilger Posts: 1,583member
    All Catalina does is take things away. It is also about as polished as a rock quarry.

    After 15 years of downloading things in Safari, you now get the "feature" of having to approve access to your Downloads folder, manually, for every single website.

    You also now "get to" approve access to every single directory any app might request access to. That will go over real well. Since users have no idea why an App needs access to what it needs to access to, users will deny it, and the app will not function. Real smart Apple.

    I guess Apple really wants developers to move to web apps. They are much more attractive these days than making native Mac apps. Much, much more.
    That's not accurate. Catalina ads a wide range of useful new features, and even the primary thing "being taken away," 32 bit app support, also brings advantages from thinning out all the 32 bit frameworks and other code that most users have zero need for.

    Given that you can continue to run 32 bit apps on your hardware in Mojave, it's hard to understand what you're upset about. It's a free OS update, it's not mandatory, it's reversible, and you can non-exclusively update while still maintaining a Mojave boot alternative. What has you so upset about it? Sounds like manufactured outrage.
    StrangeDayscat52fastasleeplollivermacpluspluswatto_cobra
  • Reply 36 of 168
    this is a novel not a blog post. woulda been better served split into a few articles. 


    64 bit all the way. forward! some will whine some will call the whaaambulance! 
    mbenz1962
  • Reply 37 of 168
    All Catalina does is take things away. It is also about as polished as a rock quarry.

    After 15 years of downloading things in Safari, you now get the "feature" of having to approve access to your Downloads folder, manually, for every single website.

    You also now "get to" approve access to every single directory any app might request access to. That will go over real well. Since users have no idea why an App needs access to what it needs to access to, users will deny it, and the app will not function. Real smart Apple.

    I guess Apple really wants developers to move to web apps. They are much more attractive these days than making native Mac apps. Much, much more.
    That's not accurate. Catalina ads a wide range of useful new features, and even the primary thing "being taken away," 32 bit app support, also brings advantages from thinning out all the 32 bit frameworks and other code that most users have zero need for.

    Given that you can continue to run 32 bit apps on your hardware in Mojave, it's hard to understand what you're upset about. It's a free OS update, it's not mandatory, it's reversible, and you can non-exclusively update while still maintaining a Mojave boot alternative. What has you so upset about it? Sounds like manufactured outrage.
    If you want, or need to buy new hardware (I am sure they will release shortly), it will not run anything but Catalina, so it is forcing peoples hands pretty fast. 
  • Reply 38 of 168
    ednlednl Posts: 61member
    ednl said:
    Not all 32-bit software is ancient. I use Lightroom 6 standalone and have no alternative lined up yet, certainly not the subscription.
    Lightroom 6 is a 64 bit app. Does it show up as 32-bit in your system report? It does cause warnings in Mojave, but this may be due to other linked software it shipped with.
    Ah right, the installer & activation is 32-bit. So uninstalling or reinstalling or (re-) activating will be impossible. Upgrading a system should be fine (until you need/want to reinstall LR) but a fresh install of Catalina is a no go if you need LR6. Thanks.
  • Reply 39 of 168
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,158member
    crowley said:
    Not sure which part was supposed to be crucial?

    I may install it on a partition when I have some time to kill, but ditching 32-bit apps... that's a tough pill to build up to, it'll take a while.
    What 32 bit apps do you use? 
    Games mainly, most of which will never be updated https://www.macgamerhq.com/opinion/32-bit-mac-games/
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 40 of 168
    DED, thank you for your unreadable level of detail, as once again it is the details that matter in subjects like the OS.

    I have been gripping on to Quicktime 7 Pro for so many year due to its import image sequence function. Fearing the day if would finally be ripped from my cold dead hands. Only you would bother to report that Apple has finally added into their modern QTP.

    Does it also allow for the saving of files in the amazing QT reference format, that just references where the media is instead of embedding it in the .mov?

    I will see soon enough.

    My take away from this article is that it is time to wipe my Mac and do a clean install, there is so much deep transformational stuff going on with this release, one does not want to glue it up with the past.

    last pondering - what is happening with the file storing of media, given the splitting of iTunes? Are the folders being messed with, are there issues for people who store libraries out of the main user folder?

    thank you for the detail and for the record i read almost all of it, skipping things like reminders which i do not use.
    watto_cobra
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