Apple gives Greek iCloud users 30 days free service in light of financial crisis

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  • Reply 81 of 169
    cgjcgj Posts: 276member

    A lot of people are confusing the 'socialism' that exists within Nordic countries, which includes universal healthcare, higher taxes and a sustainable, green economy, with the economic system in Greece.

     

    Greece is not an example of what happens when social democracy is implemented – its an example of what happens when more than 80% of the country avoids paying tax. So perhaps it's time members here stopped trying to act as though socialist policies have been the root of all of Greece's problems.

     

    Speaking as a European, I feel what is happening in Greece is terrible. A deal needs to be made, and even as someone who is pro-EU, I believe Greece needs to leave the Euro. Its economy is not to the standard of Sweden, Germany, France or even Italy – it was a bad move in the beginning, and it's bad to keep them in now. <sidenote>I'm also hoping for a return to the Drachma as I'm sure the Pound-Drachma currency conversion will be great!</sidenote>. Leaving the Euro won't solve all of Greece's problems, but it should come with a major restructuring of loans that will allow the Greek economy to grow – rather than forcing it to shrink even further.

     

    (Edit: Obviously this is a good move from Apple, not magical but there's not much else they can do.)

  • Reply 82 of 169
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 19,410member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

     

    It's called accountability, and yes, people are accountable and responsible for the choices that they make in life.


    So, here's a question for you, Apple][ and Tallest Skil (and I could add a few other names). Hopefully, you'll give us an honest answer.

     

    Suppose you're walking along the road, and you come across someone who was hit by a car is bleeding to death. You ask him what happened, and he admits to being drunk and jaywalking. He's wearing a "Hillary for President" button.

     

    What would you do? (Assume he does not have a cell phone because he's poor, you however do, and what's more, you're getting 5 bars of signal).

  • Reply 83 of 169
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 19,410member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post

    Remind me which country landed on the moon again?

    Remind me, which country has the possibility of landing on the moon now?

  • Reply 84 of 169
    splifsplif Posts: 592member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post



    A child is satisfied with a simple toy, yet achieves little. Remind me which country landed on the moon again?

    Remind us all of how that was funded.

  • Reply 85 of 169
    So, here's a question for you, Apple][ and Tallest Skil (and I could add a few other names). Hopefully, you'll give us an honest answer.

    Suppose you're walking along the road, and you come across someone who was hit by a car is bleeding to death. You ask him what happened, and he admits to being drunk and jaywalking. He's wearing a "Hillary for President" button.

    What would you do? (Assume he does not have a cell phone because he's poor, you however do, and what's more, you're getting 5 bars of signal).

    Non sequitur. Greece's case is not a life or death situation. Also, the drunkard may be a moron (for being a drunkard and jaywalking; your political mention is an attempt to elicit political responses which I will not give you) but that does not stop me from aiding the man. He no doubt has a mother who loves him inspite of his behavior.

    Greece has hard times ahead. As do we all; the US is no exception. Hard times make or break people and nations. Avoiding the inevitable does no one any good.
  • Reply 86 of 169
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,190member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post





    My goodness, someone giving them a few dollars of cloud storage is such compassion, you're so right.











    I'm trying not to vomit from the spin here.

     

    Well, it's infinitely more compassion than someone like you can seem to manage in 50 lifetimes, so there's that.

     

    I'm always fascinated by people like you, who shit on and belittle the positive things than another party does. He never said it was the most compassionate act in history, he just stated that it WAS compassionate. Which is objectively true, and which for some reason makes you want to vomit.

     

    When someone is being fucked 6 ways to Sunday, any compassionate act is seen as very meaningful- although I doubt that's something you will ever understand, as you lack something called empathy. 

  • Reply 87 of 169
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,490member
    So as long as no humans of any political inclination are allowed to involve themselves in any way, socialism works pretty well.

    I think that’s the best description of the process that I’ve ever seen.

    You want a silver bullet? Okay: destroy fiat currency and return to a currency backed by, well, silver.

    I agree a commodity backed currency would be better, although just opening economies up to currency competition would result in best of class solutions. People could end up backing Canadian Maple Leaf gold coin backed digital currency, for example.
  • Reply 88 of 169
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,738member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

     

    So, here's a question for you, Apple][ and Tallest Skil (and I could add a few other names). Hopefully, you'll give us an honest answer.

     

    Suppose you're walking along the road, and you come across someone who was hit by a car is bleeding to death. You ask him what happened, and he admits to being drunk and jaywalking. He's wearing a "Hillary for President" button.

     

    What would you do? (Assume he does not have a cell phone because he's poor, you however do, and what's more, you're getting 5 bars of signal).




    And here's my honest answer. I wouldn't touch them or attempt to help them in any way, as I am not a qualified medical practitioner, and I also would not want to get involved or be liable for anything legal. I would obviously call 911 for them, if they did not have their own phone, no matter what kind of political button they were wearing, unless it was an ISIS button or an Al-Qaeda button or something similar.

  • Reply 89 of 169
    appexappex Posts: 687member

    The big questions are how did Greece reach such dire straits and how to prevent it for them and for everybody in the future? In other words, we must learn from experience or else we will repeat it. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

  • Reply 90 of 169
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

     

     

    Well, it's infinitely more compassion than someone like you can seem to manage in 50 lifetimes, so there's that.

     

    I'm always fascinated by people like you, who shit on and belittle the positive things than another party does. He never said it was the most compassionate act in history, he just stated that it WAS compassionate. Which is objectively true, and which for some reason makes you want to vomit.

     

    When someone is being fucked 6 ways to Sunday, any compassionate act is seen as very meaningful- although I doubt that's something you will ever understand, as you lack something called empathy. 


     

    He said the Greek people would be sure to remember it. That seems to imply the act is closer to Mother Teresa rather than just a company after a little good PR and hoping to be able to auto-bill those customers again soon enough.

     

    Empathy is a tool; I use it, it is not my master.

     

    A few years ago I was experiencing daily pain, which interfered with my ability to live a normal life. I had the option of putting up with it or having surgery to treat the issue. The surgery left me largely incapacitated for a week, and I had months of recovery ahead. Now I'm fine.

     

    Greece is the same way; they can either keep delaying the inevitable, making it worse (if I'd gotten it taken care of earlier the surgery and recovery would have been much less difficult), or they can go through the pain now and come out better for it on the other side. It takes empathy and compassion to recognize when someone needs to pass through a trial themselves; it would not be compassionate to prolong suffering.

     

    PS: Using profanity to make your points weakens your argument; profanity is a childish tool, not something to be found in the vocabulary of a civilized adult.

  • Reply 91 of 169
    crowleycrowley Posts: 6,057member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

    Also rates higher than every country on Earth save one in rape. Wonder why…


     

    <img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />

     

    That is genuinely amazing.  Did you actually just try and imply (through "wondering") that socialism is responsible for rape in Sweden?

     

    <img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />

     

    Putting aside the transparent attempt to distract away from a pertinent point, you're completely and utterly wrong, as usual.  Sweden's high rape reporting is due to a number of factors, including but not limited to:

     


    1. Sweden actually reports and investigates rape very well, much more thoroughly than most other countries.  

    2. Sweden has a significantly more open culture for for encouraging women to come forward with rape allegations.  There is less stigma than in many other countries.

    3. Sweden categorises rape quite widely.  Things which would be sexual assault in a lot of other countries are called rape in Sweden.

     

    Actually, you know what, you are right.  Sweden's socialist government and culture has led to these three factors, so socialism has led to Sweden's high reported rape rate, to positive ends.  Well done, your hateful dirge inadvertently hit on something.

  • Reply 92 of 169
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AppeX View Post

     

    The big questions are how did Greece reach such dire straits and how to prevent it for them and for everybody in the future? In other words, we must learn from experience or else we will repeat it. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.




    I saw a new take on that the other day; those who remember the past are doomed to watch everyone else repeat it. <img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />

  • Reply 93 of 169
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,190member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post

     

     

    He said the Greek people would be sure to remember it. That seems to imply the act is closer to Mother Teresa rather than just a company after a little good PR and hoping to be able to auto-bill those customers again soon enough.

     

    Empathy is a tool; I use it, it is not my master.

     

    A few years ago I was experiencing daily pain, which interfered with my ability to live a normal life. I had the option of putting up with it or having surgery to treat the issue. The surgery left me largely incapacitated for a week, and I had months of recovery ahead. Now I'm fine.

     

    Greece is the same way; they can either keep delaying the inevitable, making it worse (if I'd gotten it taken care of earlier the surgery and recovery would have been much less difficult), or they can go through the pain now and come out better for it on the other side. It takes empathy and compassion to recognize when someone needs to pass through a trial themselves; it would not be compassionate to prolong suffering.

     

    PS: Using profanity to make your points weakens your argument; profanity is a childish tool, not something to be found in the vocabulary of a civilized adult.


     

    Stop using the "profanity" accusation as a crutch to pretend that you're somehow superior in maturity. Would "screwed" 6 ways to Sunday be better for you? It's a damn expression. Speaking of childishness, there's nothing more childish than that simplistic analogy you just espoused, pretending to make some kind of meaningful statement. No, nothing from what he said made me think of Mother Teresa. Unfortunately, false sensationalism, absurd analogies, and logical fallacies are the only tools in your arsenal. There's also nothing in your post that has any bearing no why Apple shouldn't give a shred of goodwill to people who have been paying for the service, and got it interrupted through no fault of their own, which you seem offended by.  There's nothing "civilized" about any of that, no matter how much you wish you were. 

  • Reply 94 of 169
    lightknightlightknight Posts: 2,312member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

     

    So as long as no humans of any political inclination are allowed to involve themselves in any way, socialism works pretty well.

     

    I think that’s the best description of the process that I’ve ever seen.

     

    You want a silver bullet? Okay: destroy fiat currency and return to a currency backed by, well, silver.


    It did not work that well in Imperial Rome.

    Check out Rome's Capitolin Museums currency collection, btw, it's awesome. You'll see how Emperors had very similar problems to ours, even with a currency based on Silver, then Gold.

  • Reply 95 of 169
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,738member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Crowley View Post

     

    That is genuinely amazing.  Did you actually just try and imply (through "wondering") that socialism is responsible for rape in Sweden?


     

    Most definitely. Europe's leftwing turncoats are responsible for their failed experiment called "multiculturalism", and these leftwing socialists and destroyers of western society are definitely responsible for the high rape rates in Sweden. There are numerous articles that have been written about this topic.

  • Reply 96 of 169
    crowleycrowley Posts: 6,057member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

     

     

    Most definitely. Europe's leftwing turncoats are responsible for their failed experiment called "multiculturalism", and these leftwing socialists and destroyers of western society are definitely responsible for the high rape rates in Sweden. There are numerous articles that have been written about this topic.




    Sure.  Because all the immigrants in Europe go to Sweden.  Obviously you're right and that must be the reason.  

     

    Seriously, do you apply any intellectual rigour at all to this nonsense?

     

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

  • Reply 97 of 169

    I have to agree with anantksundaram. I too am surprised by the tone of comments in this forum. They are mean-spirited, ignorant and hateful. Not at all what I expect from the Apple community. I am not quoting any poster in my response as I don't want to be seen as attacking any person, but I do want to respond to some of the ideas shared on this forum.

     

    First and foremost, this article is about a nice gesture by Apple to help customers affected by a system freeze that prevents them from paying for their iCloud service. This is a very considerate of Apple and would be seen by customers worldwide as a sign of Apple’s customer-centric business model. This is no different from them helping you out when your credit card is frozen temporarily by your bank - by a fraud alert, for example. It has nothing to do with the rights and wrongs of the Greek debt crisis, or the value of any economic system. 

     

    The venom and judgmental attitude shown here towards Greece seems out of proportion to the actual damage caused by the Greek crisis. After all, the Greek crisis has had a negligible effect on the US and world economy, when compared to the great financial crisis of 2008. Is Greece’s ‘socialism’ any worse than the truly criminal acts committed by Wall Street that ruined our economy and millions of lives? Are you more affected by the Greek crisis than the crimes of Wall Street that led to destruction of the US economy, the displacement of thousands of families from their homes, and the transfer of hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars to Wall Street bankers? No? Why then do you feel more hate and scorn for the Greeks than the criminals in your own country who destroyed your economy and your home's value?

     

    The comments that say that the Greek pensioners should suffer seem particularly hateful. The man has money - he just can’t get to it. Some posters blame individual Greeks for their government’s mistakes and feel that they deserve no sympathy. Perhaps they are right. But then, would these posters also agree that any American killed by terrorists ‘deserves it’ because his government has consistently supported homicidal dictators and overthrown several democratically elected governments? Please show me the posts where you made this case about the 9/11 victims, and I will take your ‘principled’ position on Greek pensioners more seriously. I would also love to see these posters tell their fellow 'Capitalism-loving, Greece-hating Americans' that the 9/11 and Boston Bombing victims deserved what they got. They would have every bone in their body broken by their fellow patriots. 

     

    Greece's creditors are no different from payday lenders who willingly accept the risks of lending to people with poor credit. They got absurdly high interest rates that reflected the risk involved. They can't come crying now that the loans went bad. This is how the free-market works. These fake-Capitalists want all the upside and none of the downside of real free-markets.  The key issue here is that the world economic community is applying double-standards. Why did AIG’s counter-parties receive a 100% bailout from taxpayers when AIG went bankrupt? Why didn’t these free-market ideologues accept their losses instead of stealing from taxpayers? When banks lie on mortgage forms they get off scot-free, but when a individuals lie on loan applications they lose their house and go to jail. WTF is that? The government should bail out big banks when their bets go wrong, but individual citizens (or Greece) should suffer if they fall on hard times. Yeah, that makes sense .... not!!

     

    The blame placed on ‘Socialism’ seems even more bizarre. When questioned, these posters claim that in ‘reality’ socialism has failed. Is it any more of a failure than the ‘crony-Capitalism’ that is the reality in the US and many other countries? When was the last time we had a truly free market in our country? These defenders of Capitalism always compare their ‘ideal’ version of Capitalism against the ‘reality’ of socialism in selected countries. The truth is that the fake-Capitalism practiced in the US has led to outright theft of property from the common man by the economic elite. It has also led to a disgusting level of poverty in the richest country on earth, where economic success has become disconnected from merit and effort. I only ask that the defenders of pure Capitalism (that exists nowhere on earth) and critics of ’Socialism’ exhibit some degree of intellectual honesty in their arguments. Or better yet, save it for other forums and keep discussion on this forum to the subject at hand.

     

    Lastly, the comment about ‘which country landed not the moon’ is absurd. We did not land on the moon because our 'greatness'. We got there only because we imported Nazi rocket-scientists and gave them amnesty in return for helping our rocket program. Our willingness to sell out our principles in return for some Nazi technology is nothing to be proud of. All while lecturing the rest of the world on morality. If the Greeks had ‘bought’ these Nazi scientists, they would have landed on the moon instead of us. So, please spare us the jingoistic, ignorant rhetoric.

  • Reply 98 of 169
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 19,410member
    apple ][ wrote: »

    And here's my honest answer. I wouldn't touch them or attempt to help them in any way, as I am not a qualified medical practitioner, and I also would not want to get involved or be liable for anything legal. I would obviously call 911 for them, if they did not have their own phone, no matter what kind of political button they were wearing, unless it was an ISIS button or an Al-Qaeda button or something similar.

    Appreciate the honest answer. The point is, you wouldn't just point and go, "wheee, a socialist who should be held accountable for his actions."

    Why is your answer different with Greece?


    Non sequitur. Greece's case is not a life or death situation. Also, the drunkard may be a moron (for being a drunkard and jaywalking; your political mention is an attempt to elicit political responses which I will not give you) but that does not stop me from aiding the man. He no doubt has a mother who loves him inspite of his behavior.

    Greece has hard times ahead. As do we all; the US is no exception. Hard times make or break people and nations. Avoiding the inevitable does no one any good.

    You simply evaded the question. If I took out the words "..to death" out of my post, it is not a non sequitur at all.
  • Reply 99 of 169
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Splif View Post

     

    Remind us all of how that was funded.


    By free-market loving capitalists and corporations no doubt!

  • Reply 100 of 169
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TheWhiteFalcon View Post

     

    PS: Using profanity to make your points weakens your argument; profanity is a childish tool, not something to be found in the vocabulary of a civilized adult.




    But responding to a reasonable comment by wanting to vomit is very adult! Thanks for the lesson in maturity.

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